365 RWHP on the dynojet - Page 2

GeniusInABottle · 06-20-2008, 12:11 PM

From my understanding, VTEC was supposed to be Honda's answer to a turbo, so it's not that bad. Watch some in-car videos on youtube of VTEC kicking in, it definitely looks turbo-like.

Nemesis · 06-20-2008, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedSkyWV

While your post is spot on Nemesis, it makes me sad to have our turbos compared to a vtec

Dang, I said the "V" word! Isn't there supposed to be some kind of filter on this site for language like that?....sheesh...

|V3nom| · 06-20-2008, 04:20 PM

vtec...all of the lag, none of the boost

.

RedSkyWV · 06-20-2008, 04:22 PM

It's not consistent power throughout the band like a supercharger, and it does kick in in the mid-upper RPMs like a turbo, the kick-in is noticeable but far from a turbo. Maybe if our turbo was limited to 5psi it would feel the same. VTEC is a cheap alternative to a turbo though, and it serves its purpose, we here driving American cars shudder at the comparison though

bun1t · 06-20-2008, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeniusInABottle

From my understanding, VTEC was supposed to be Honda's answer to a turbo, so it's not that bad. Watch some in-car videos on youtube of VTEC kicking in, it definitely looks turbo-like.

I guess you need to see what a real turbo feels like.

RPIpower · 06-20-2008, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeniusInABottle

From my understanding, VTEC was supposed to be Honda's answer to a turbo, so it's not that bad. Watch some in-car videos on youtube of VTEC kicking in, it definitely looks turbo-like.

It was never an answer to turbocharging. Who ever made that story up should be shot. Forced induction increases the volumetric efficiency of the engine and vtec does not even function the same. Its a timing issue.

GeniusInABottle · 06-21-2008, 03:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPIpower

It was never an answer to turbocharging. Who ever made that story up should be shot. Forced induction increases the volumetric efficiency of the engine and vtec does not even function the same. Its a timing issue.

Didn't say they worked the same, but they're supposed to have somewhat of a similar effect.

"Additionally, Japan has a tax on engine displacement, requiring Japanese auto manufacturers to make higher-performing engines with lower displacement. In cars such as the Toyota Supra and Nissan 300ZX, this was accomplished with a turbocharger. In the case of the Mazda RX-7 and RX-8, a rotary engine was used. VTEC serves as yet another method to derive very high specific output from lower displacement motors."

Source

|V3nom| · 06-21-2008, 08:30 AM

basically every somewhat high end 4 and 6 cyls all have vtec in essence, only its not called that, its called variable valve timing. honda was just the first to come out with it to help out with the higher rpms but even our cars have it. like eloy said, its NOTHING like a turbo at all.

bun1t · 06-21-2008, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeniusInABottle

Didn't say they worked the same, but they're supposed to have somewhat of a similar effect.

Comparing vtec to a turbo is like comparing a CAI to a supercharger.

Lithium Lotus · 06-21-2008, 11:04 PM

VTEC is the switching of cams when the engine reaches a certain rpm. One cam is used for normal everyday driving, while a second more aggressive cam is used for performance driving. Ford and Toyota had the first patents for VTEC in 1977, but Honda was the first company to use it in mass production.

VTEC - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

tym · 06-22-2008, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GhostRL

Back pressure is the enemy. Period.

When you're running a large turbo/lots of boost, the EGTs tend to melt/destroy most cats... not that it can't be done, but I have no use for a cat on my car and it's certainly easier to manuever in the engine bay without one in the way.

Just curious when you refer to the "cat", is this the catalytic converter? And if it is, it sounds like you have removed it, doesn't this affect the emissions, here where I am, we have to have the cars go thru a gov't emission test every other year.

GhostRL · 06-22-2008, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tym

Just curious when you refer to the "cat", is this the catalytic converter? And if it is, it sounds like you have removed it, doesn't this affect the emissions, here where I am, we have to have the cars go thru a gov't emission test every other year.

Any 1997-present car just gets plugged into a computer (unless your in cali). So long as there's no codes (mine are turned off completely) you can't fail.

RPIpower · 06-23-2008, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeniusInABottle

Didn't say they worked the same, but they're supposed to have somewhat of a similar effect.

Not even close enough to call it "similar". One has to do with forced induction and increasing volumetric efficiency and the other has to do with ignition/cam timing.

Nemesis · 06-23-2008, 05:14 PM

Wow, did my post snowball or what?

Bogie · 06-23-2008, 06:05 PM

Is there really any effective difference between VTEC and the VVT designed into the Ecotec? Maybe slight differences in design, but they functionally sound the same. Both are based on varying the CAM geometry to change the valve timing. And both are actuated via computer controlled solenoids.

shabby · 06-23-2008, 06:24 PM

Lets take the vtec discussion to a honda forum, this is aboot GhostRL's turbo upgrade.

Mallard · 06-30-2008, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bogie

Is there really any effective difference between VTEC and the VVT designed into the Ecotec? Maybe slight differences in design, but they functionally sound the same. Both are based on varying the CAM geometry to change the valve timing. And both are actuated via computer controlled solenoids.

VTEC varies valve timing and lift, GM VVT is just altering the cam timing.

|V3nom| · 07-01-2008, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mallard

VTEC varies valve timing and lift, GM VVT is just altering the cam timing.

i guess you dont know what the vvt stands for variable valve timing

.

Mallard · 07-01-2008, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by |V3nom|

i guess you dont know what the vvt stands for variable valve timing

.

I guess you don't know that the valves are actuated by the cams.

VTEC has two different lobes on the cams, one for high lift/high rpm power and another for low rpm economy.

i-VTEC is VTEC with the addition of cam phasors. This can advance or retard the position of the cam and alter valve timing.

GM VVT (Variable Valve Timing) is only using cam phasors.

|V3nom| · 07-01-2008, 04:17 PM

ehh close enuf :P.

compdoc777 · 07-31-2008, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baldturbofreak

The Low revs were for fuel consumption and the small turbo.
Gm figured that since americans liked the insta-boost of the supercharger they would do their best to have a instant spool setup with the BW. (not to mention several other emissions/economy related issues)

To have a snail that wheel's up @1800rpm means that it will run out of capacity low in the rev's. Plot the airflow vs boost onthe factory compressor map and you'll find the redline is there to keep the wheel from G'n out and exploding.

Will I be changing valvesprings and retainers when I finally get to rev my car out? yup. With my GT3076R setup I should pull strong out to 7500rpm. and to stay away from valve flaot at hihg psi it will be a nessecity.

Crank- no worries
Rods-no worries
Pistons- heavy but strong- stop at 7500rpm
Block- wont tickle a thing!
Factory head gasket& studs- fine until your over 500whp. Bet on it. (unless you do it real low in the rev range)

Only thing I have been forewarned about ios the stock cast balance shafts could take a dump over 7500..

I am looking to upgrade my turbo. What would I need to put the GT3076R into my Redline.

Thanks,

-Matt

06-20-2008, 12:11 PM	#31 (permalink)
GeniusInABottle Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: SF Bay Area, California Posts: 127 My Photos: (3)	From my understanding, VTEC was supposed to be Honda's answer to a turbo, so it's not that bad. Watch some in-car videos on youtube of VTEC kicking in, it definitely looks turbo-like. __________________ 2008 Saturn Sky Redline \| BSR Stage 1 Tune, RPi Stage 2 IC, GMPP Air Intake, GM Turbo Cat-Back Exhaust, Eibach Pro-Kit Springs, Konig Again 5 Wheels, 245/45 Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3 Tires

06-20-2008, 04:20 PM	#33 (permalink)
\|V3nom\| Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Denham Springs, LA Posts: 339 My Photos: (0)	vtec...all of the lag, none of the boost . __________________ Mods: Dejon Spring Magnaflow 3" catback Wastegate Mod: 21psi Removed gm emblems behind front tires Xentec 8K HIDs Low Beams and Fogs Parking Light Leds License Plate Leds Little Chromies 3rd brake light vinyl: REDLINE

06-21-2008, 08:30 AM	#38 (permalink)
\|V3nom\| Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Denham Springs, LA Posts: 339 My Photos: (0)	basically every somewhat high end 4 and 6 cyls all have vtec in essence, only its not called that, its called variable valve timing. honda was just the first to come out with it to help out with the higher rpms but even our cars have it. like eloy said, its NOTHING like a turbo at all. __________________ Mods: Dejon Spring Magnaflow 3" catback Wastegate Mod: 21psi Removed gm emblems behind front tires Xentec 8K HIDs Low Beams and Fogs Parking Light Leds License Plate Leds Little Chromies 3rd brake light vinyl: REDLINE

06-21-2008, 11:04 PM	#40 (permalink)
Lithium Lotus Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Youngstown, Ohio Posts: 115 My Photos: (0)	VTEC is the switching of cams when the engine reaches a certain rpm. One cam is used for normal everyday driving, while a second more aggressive cam is used for performance driving. Ford and Toyota had the first patents for VTEC in 1977, but Honda was the first company to use it in mass production. VTEC - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia __________________ 2007 Solstice GXP "Natsumi" Japanese female name that translates to Summer Beauty.

06-23-2008, 05:14 PM	#44 (permalink)
Nemesis First 2000 Sr. Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: was NC, now AL Posts: 808 My Photos: (0)	Wow, did my post snowball or what? __________________ 2007 Silver Pearl RL Alloys, single CD Monsoon Black Leather Manual Trans K&N Replacement Filter No E10

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06-20-2008, 04:22 PM	#34 (permalink)
RedSkyWV Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Morgantown WV Posts: 218 My Photos: (0)	It's not consistent power throughout the band like a supercharger, and it does kick in in the mid-upper RPMs like a turbo, the kick-in is noticeable but far from a turbo. Maybe if our turbo was limited to 5psi it would feel the same. VTEC is a cheap alternative to a turbo though, and it serves its purpose, we here driving American cars shudder at the comparison though

06-23-2008, 06:05 PM	#45 (permalink)
Bogie Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Northern, VA Posts: 2,476 My Photos: (0)	Is there really any effective difference between VTEC and the VVT designed into the Ecotec? Maybe slight differences in design, but they functionally sound the same. Both are based on varying the CAM geometry to change the valve timing. And both are actuated via computer controlled solenoids. __________________ 2008 Redline Black Onyx Black/Red Leather Monsoon 6 Disc Spoiler French Transmission Born July 2007 Snagged 8/31/07 Belle? That's my car Alizée? That's my avatar Me? Forty something male skydriver

06-23-2008, 06:24 PM	#46 (permalink)
shabby Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: eh Posts: 346 My Photos: (0)	Lets take the vtec discussion to a honda forum, this is aboot GhostRL's turbo upgrade. __________________ 2007 Solstice gxp

07-01-2008, 04:17 PM	#50 (permalink)
\|V3nom\| Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Denham Springs, LA Posts: 339 My Photos: (0)	ehh close enuf :P. __________________ Mods: Dejon Spring Magnaflow 3" catback Wastegate Mod: 21psi Removed gm emblems behind front tires Xentec 8K HIDs Low Beams and Fogs Parking Light Leds License Plate Leds Little Chromies 3rd brake light vinyl: REDLINE