Problem with our Month Old Redline!!!!!!!!!!!

Soul TKR · 09-23-2008, 02:22 AM

Hey guys... try and make this as short as possible...

Got a new '08 Redline about a month ago. It's an automatic and has around 1300-1400 miles on it...

This morning, I took it out for a spin to the local Jack In The Box. Since we've had it, we've babied it, trying to break it in properly. Well, this morning during my little drive, i decided it's probably well broken in by now and wanted to finally see what she had... so I switched my guages to the boost guage and hit the gas...

here's where it gets weird...

PSI stayed at 0.... went up to 4-5psi for about half a second... then went back down to 0... Keep in mind, the pedal was to the floor. The car felt like a complete dog... as I'm sure it was just running on engine with no turbo.

I get home, call up the local dealership, where I spoke to a nice technician there named Chris. He told me to bring the car in, and they'll have a look at it.

I then went out to the garage, and drove the sky to the dealership. On the way there, i decided to hit it a few more times to see if the problem was still there.... to my surprise... Boost kicked in! Car ran like a raped ape... In fact it was hitting 20-21psi...

Now, i'm no expert, but that seems a little high on a stock car? Or is this normal?

I mentioned it to Chris when I finally got there, and told him, it seems to me like it could be a wastegate issue... he asked if there were any codes being thrown, I said no, i haven't seen a light come on...

well, the day went by... he gave me a call this evening. Told me that they checked the computer, and it in fact Logged a code... which has since went away. He said it could have came on, then went away fairly quickly and I just never noticed it. He said it was throwing an OVERBOOST code....

He said, at this point, it's nothing to worry about, as the car seemed to have fixed itself

and what happened was, when the overboost code was thrown, it shut off the turbo at that point and that's why what happened, happened...

so... is it just me, or does this seem a little odd to any of you?

Month Old Car

Technician says everything is fine now

But, my thinking is, why did this happen in the first place?

am I worried over nothing? And what kind of boost is everyone else getting out of these cars stock?

Thanks for your input guys

JeffInDFW · 09-23-2008, 03:45 AM

Try to not worry (you do have a warranty), and just watch to see if it does it again.

When I took delivery of mine, it had a terrible rattle in the dash and the seat wobbled like crazy. Two days later, both problems fixed themselves and have not done it again since!

xmicro_Redline · 09-23-2008, 05:12 AM

Maybe some of the more technical members may correct me, but if I am not mistaken, the computer does need to "learn" the specifics of the engine. Maybe since you babied it, it had yet to read a max boost. The computer probably just had to adjust so you cannot keep reaching the higher boost. The factory programing is always super safe, so you get more life out of the car. I know some members get more HP out of an aftermarket tune by increasing the boost, but of course that shortens the life of the turbo. I would not worry unless it happens again.

These cars are so computer centric. When I first got the car, I drove around with around 1500 miles on it, I parked it, and when I went to restart it it would not start. I waited 10 minutes and it started. That NEVER happened again and I now have over 10,000 miles and 1 and 1/2 years later. So it is possible it made the adjustment and that is it!

Good Luck and welcome to the forum!

**G8TR** · 09-23-2008, 11:12 AM

Welcome to the forum!

Typical boost on a stock engine, taking into account all factors, is usually 16 or 17 psi.

Rob the Elder · 09-23-2008, 11:31 AM

your statement
I know some members get more HP out of an aftermarket tune by increasing the boost, but of course that shortens the life of the turbo.

Is not correct to the best of my knowledge. The turbo is a mechanical system that has no adjustable paramaters once its installed. The rate of flow and volume of the exhaust gasses provide input to the impeller which spins the turbo. The turbo produces a fixed and linear amount of boost on the positive pressure side based on how fast its spinning. The boost that the motor intake sees is controlled by the boost gate which allows some of the positive pressure to bleed off through the boost valve. This modulates the rate of pressure gain seen at the intake as well as the upper limit. None of this impacts the turbo directly as its just grinding out positive pressure as a direct and fixed function of the volume and velocity of exhaust gasses it sees.

None of the tunes really affect the life of the turbo.

**Tamay48** · 09-23-2008, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul TKR

Hey guys... try and make this as short as possible...

Got a new '08 Redline about a month ago. It's an automatic and has around 1300-1400 miles on it...

This morning, I took it out for a spin to the local Jack In The Box. Since we've had it, we've babied it, trying to break it in properly. Well, this morning during my little drive, i decided it's probably well broken in by now and wanted to finally see what she had... so I switched my guages to the boost guage and hit the gas...

here's where it gets weird...

PSI stayed at 0.... went up to 4-5psi for about half a second... then went back down to 0... Keep in mind, the pedal was to the floor. The car felt like a complete dog... as I'm sure it was just running on engine with no turbo.

I get home, call up the local dealership, where I spoke to a nice technician there named Chris. He told me to bring the car in, and they'll have a look at it.

I then went out to the garage, and drove the sky to the dealership. On the way there, i decided to hit it a few more times to see if the problem was still there.... to my surprise... Boost kicked in! Car ran like a raped ape... In fact it was hitting 20-21psi...

Now, i'm no expert, but that seems a little high on a stock car? Or is this normal?

I mentioned it to Chris when I finally got there, and told him, it seems to me like it could be a wastegate issue... he asked if there were any codes being thrown, I said no, i haven't seen a light come on...

well, the day went by... he gave me a call this evening. Told me that they checked the computer, and it in fact Logged a code... which has since went away. He said it could have came on, then went away fairly quickly and I just never noticed it. He said it was throwing an OVERBOOST code....

He said, at this point, it's nothing to worry about, as the car seemed to have fixed itself

and what happened was, when the overboost code was thrown, it shut off the turbo at that point and that's why what happened, happened...

so... is it just me, or does this seem a little odd to any of you?

Month Old Car

Technician says everything is fine now

But, my thinking is, why did this happen in the first place?

am I worried over nothing? And what kind of boost is everyone else getting out of these cars stock?

Thanks for your input guys

Okay, here is just my

First what was the rate of speed before you tried to Floor It

I seriously don't believe it will go into Boost (Turbo) under 50 miles an hour.

I am a speed

myself and my car does like to go less than 80mph on the Highway

Point is I have never tried to go into Boost Mode under 45mph

0-60 no boost
60-80 boost
over 80mph hold on

Bottom Line - Take Your Time - Learn Your Ride - Then Take It to the "SKY"

BTW - Welcome to the SKY Club

SCVanguard · 09-23-2008, 01:45 PM

[quote=Tamay48;362478]Okay, here is just my

I seriously don't believe it will go into Boost (Turbo) under 50 miles an hour.

QUOTE]

I don't know about your car, but mine will get at least a few psi off of a dead launch if I go past 50% on the throttle...

Back to the OP...I had an awkward issue like this before as well. The car had a hard start and the short drive I took felt REALLY BAD. I could hear the turbo wind up but no boost was hitting the engine. It made NO SENSE. After the next start, everything was back to normal.

In my case, the only thing different for that bad start was that the car had it's passenger side on top of a curb. Was that the case for you?

Soul TKR · 09-23-2008, 03:51 PM

[quote=SCVanguard;362522]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamay48

Okay, here is just my

I seriously don't believe it will go into Boost (Turbo) under 50 miles an hour.

QUOTE]In my case, the only thing different for that bad start was that the car had it's passenger side on top of a curb. Was that the case for you?

not sure what your asking...

THANKS GUYS FOR ALL YOUR INPUT!

Guess we'll just drive it and see what happens... like you guys said, IT'S UNDER WARRANTY....

SCVanguard · 09-23-2008, 04:27 PM

Sorry Wes...the format bug bit me.

I was asking that when you started your car and had that issue, was your car on a level street or was the car angled in some fashion? In my case where I had the issue you described, my passenger side wheels were up on a curb, thus putting the car at a ~20* angle slanting toward the driver side.

**cfjara** · 09-23-2008, 05:21 PM

check for loose turbo/ intercooler hoses.

Soul TKR · 09-23-2008, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCVanguard

Sorry Wes...the format bug bit me.

I was asking that when you started your car and had that issue, was your car on a level street or was the car angled in some fashion? In my case where I had the issue you described, my passenger side wheels were up on a curb, thus putting the car at a ~20* angle slanting toward the driver side.

Oh lol... in that case... No, it was on flat ground

**MataguaySky** · 09-24-2008, 01:47 AM

I have found with my 08' RL Auto is that you do not want to stomp it to WOT.

You hit it 2/3 to 3/4 throttle for maybe 1/2 second to let it rev a bit then push it all the way down.

Also mine will boost anytime and any speed with enough pedal.

Soul TKR · 09-24-2008, 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MataguaySky

I have found with my 08' RL Auto is that you do not want to stomp it to WOT.

You hit it 2/3 to 3/4 throttle for maybe 1/2 second to let it rev a bit then push it all the way down.

Also mine will boost anytime and any speed with enough pedal.

yea... i pretty much stomped it from a dig... got some wheel chirp and it took off like a horse getting branded

xmicro_Redline · 09-24-2008, 05:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamay48

I seriously don't believe it will go into Boost (Turbo) under 50 miles an hour.

I am a speed

myself and my car does like to go less than 80mph on the Highway

Point is I have never tried to go into Boost Mode under 45mph

0-60 no boost
60-80 boost
over 80mph hold on

Tamay , check your boost gauge on your DIC, you get most of your boost on take off, less at the top end. If you mash it from a stop, you will absolutely get tons of boost, or the car is a dog. Try driving even at a steady 20 mph and just tap the gas and let off, you can instantly hear the blow off whistle sound from the turbo....hence you get boost at even slight peddle taps. Superchargers tend to kick in more at the top end. If you ever go up hill, you ALWAYS get boost even at minimum acceleration. So even though you may not be trying, it is always working, especially on this car!

xmicro_Redline · 09-24-2008, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob the Elder

your statement
I know some members get more HP out of an aftermarket tune by increasing the boost, but of course that shortens the life of the turbo.

Is not correct to the best of my knowledge. The turbo is a mechanical system that has no adjustable paramaters once its installed. The rate of flow and volume of the exhaust gasses provide input to the impeller which spins the turbo. The turbo produces a fixed and linear amount of boost on the positive pressure side based on how fast its spinning. The boost that the motor intake sees is controlled by the boost gate which allows some of the positive pressure to bleed off through the boost valve. This modulates the rate of pressure gain seen at the intake as well as the upper limit. None of this impacts the turbo directly as its just grinding out positive pressure as a direct and fixed function of the volume and velocity of exhaust gasses it sees.

None of the tunes really affect the life of the turbo.

No Rob, you are incorrect. The amount of boost can be limited by the ECM. The tune opens up the limit to higher numbers. Here is a thread from Westers talking about what there Racing tune does :

Wester's Race Tune on Sale

He says increases the boost pressure to 23 PSI. I have heard people say they get 25 off of stock, but I am willing to bet that is more of an inaccurate gauge issue. Everything in these cars are controlled by the computer. Anyway, the tunes could effect not only the life of the turbo, but also the engine.

When the manufacturers make these cars, they have to fall in to a reliable place where the emissions always passes the strict standards, and the engine is not pushed to the limits. They need to get you past the 100,000 mile warrantee without replacing the engine. If they could get the stats up without losing either emissions or longevity, they would do it. They fight a Page Ranking battle of 0-60 numbers in the market place. All manufacturers want to say that their 0-60 numbers, and HP and torque numbers are better in their car.

**cfjara** · 09-24-2008, 09:18 AM

when playing around.....i found my turbo to redline and throw an overboost code when psi hit 26 for over a few seconds. I think 25 is the grey area.

Bogie · 09-24-2008, 05:07 PM

Mine launches like a bat out of hell with the 1/2, 3/4, WOT. And this is from dead idle, as opposed to brake and go. I would really like to have a track day where I could test this against the brake and go.

The strong first gear before the turbo kicks in full is nice because it's strong enough for a solid launch but not too strong to spin the wheels. I don't know if this is by design or serendipity, but it seems like the gearing is near perfect in giving bottom end pre-turbo gearing torque followed by the power band transition to turbo torque.

I haven't looked at the DIC boost gauge, but I don't need to...because I can feel the Newton gauge in the seat...and that's all I really care about.

Wolfheart · 10-21-2008, 04:27 PM

Sounds like the problem I had when the wastegate mod was made, it would boost up more than stock, up to 24 or 25psi, it would then set off a code and the dar would go into "safe" mode, meaning little (4 or 5 psi) then go to nothing, this woudl last until I turned the car off, then if I got on it a little boost would come on and then quickly go back to safe mode. To fix the problem I backed off the mod to close to where the factory had it, boost maxes now at maybe 18 or 19psi, but it doesn't throw a code now and doesn't go into safe mode. It is an easy fix, takes maybe 5 to 10 minutes depending upon how quickly you can get the heatshield for the turbo off.

Wolfheart · 10-21-2008, 04:35 PM

Oh, one other thing, if the wastegate control arm is not secure in it's position, meaning either the front or rear nut is lose, the arm will move and when it moves far enough it will boost up and throw the overboost code under heavy acceleration, at other times it will be fine, only way to check this is look under the turbo heatshield, if the nut on one side of the wastegate control arm is down away from the arm then it is moving and that is the problem, just tighten the bolt up to the arm and make sure both sides(nuts on either side) are tight.

09-23-2008, 02:22 AM	#1 (permalink)
Soul TKR Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Surprise, AZ Posts: 41 My Photos: (0)	Problem with our Month Old Redline!!!!!!!!!!! Hey guys... try and make this as short as possible... Got a new '08 Redline about a month ago. It's an automatic and has around 1300-1400 miles on it... This morning, I took it out for a spin to the local Jack In The Box. Since we've had it, we've babied it, trying to break it in properly. Well, this morning during my little drive, i decided it's probably well broken in by now and wanted to finally see what she had... so I switched my guages to the boost guage and hit the gas... here's where it gets weird... PSI stayed at 0.... went up to 4-5psi for about half a second... then went back down to 0... Keep in mind, the pedal was to the floor. The car felt like a complete dog... as I'm sure it was just running on engine with no turbo. I get home, call up the local dealership, where I spoke to a nice technician there named Chris. He told me to bring the car in, and they'll have a look at it. I then went out to the garage, and drove the sky to the dealership. On the way there, i decided to hit it a few more times to see if the problem was still there.... to my surprise... Boost kicked in! Car ran like a raped ape... In fact it was hitting 20-21psi... Now, i'm no expert, but that seems a little high on a stock car? Or is this normal? I mentioned it to Chris when I finally got there, and told him, it seems to me like it could be a wastegate issue... he asked if there were any codes being thrown, I said no, i haven't seen a light come on... well, the day went by... he gave me a call this evening. Told me that they checked the computer, and it in fact Logged a code... which has since went away. He said it could have came on, then went away fairly quickly and I just never noticed it. He said it was throwing an OVERBOOST code.... He said, at this point, it's nothing to worry about, as the car seemed to have fixed itself and what happened was, when the overboost code was thrown, it shut off the turbo at that point and that's why what happened, happened... so... is it just me, or does this seem a little odd to any of you? Month Old Car Technician says everything is fine now But, my thinking is, why did this happen in the first place? am I worried over nothing? And what kind of boost is everyone else getting out of these cars stock? Thanks for your input guys __________________ -Wes- 2008 Saturn Sky Redline 1999 Pontiac WS.6 Trans Am --Specs and Pics CLICK HERE-- -------------------Dyno Graph CLICK HERE-------------------

09-23-2008, 03:45 AM	#2 (permalink)
JeffInDFW First 2000 Sr. Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 108 My Photos: (13)	Try to not worry (you do have a warranty), and just watch to see if it does it again. When I took delivery of mine, it had a terrible rattle in the dash and the seat wobbled like crazy. Two days later, both problems fixed themselves and have not done it again since! __________________ 2006 Deep Solstice NA...Traded in for: 2009 Sky Redline Ruby Red Limited Edition 5 speed manual/rear spoiler added/6 disc/Monsoon Sport pedals/onstar/bluetooth Thank You Bob Lutz

09-23-2008, 11:12 AM	#4 (permalink)
G8TR Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Florida Posts: 806 My Photos: (3)	Welcome to the forum! Typical boost on a stock engine, taking into account all factors, is usually 16 or 17 psi. __________________ Life is happenstance, coincidence and what you do to make a difference. Make the best of what you have, work for more and hope for health.

09-23-2008, 11:31 AM	#5 (permalink)
Rob the Elder Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Parker Colorado Posts: 308 My Photos: (1)	Actually - no your statement I know some members get more HP out of an aftermarket tune by increasing the boost, but of course that shortens the life of the turbo. Is not correct to the best of my knowledge. The turbo is a mechanical system that has no adjustable paramaters once its installed. The rate of flow and volume of the exhaust gasses provide input to the impeller which spins the turbo. The turbo produces a fixed and linear amount of boost on the positive pressure side based on how fast its spinning. The boost that the motor intake sees is controlled by the boost gate which allows some of the positive pressure to bleed off through the boost valve. This modulates the rate of pressure gain seen at the intake as well as the upper limit. None of this impacts the turbo directly as its just grinding out positive pressure as a direct and fixed function of the volume and velocity of exhaust gasses it sees. None of the tunes really affect the life of the turbo.

09-23-2008, 01:45 PM	#7 (permalink)
SCVanguard Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 188 My Photos: (0)	[quote=Tamay48;362478]Okay, here is just my I seriously don't believe it will go into Boost (Turbo) under 50 miles an hour. QUOTE] I don't know about your car, but mine will get at least a few psi off of a dead launch if I go past 50% on the throttle... Back to the OP...I had an awkward issue like this before as well. The car had a hard start and the short drive I took felt REALLY BAD. I could hear the turbo wind up but no boost was hitting the engine. It made NO SENSE. After the next start, everything was back to normal. In my case, the only thing different for that bad start was that the car had it's passenger side on top of a curb. Was that the case for you? __________________ Brad 2008 Sky Redline Chili Pepper Red Automatic 18" chrome Monsoon Spoiler Stubby RPI GT Exhaust, Downpipe, IC, and tune http://www.imsaturn.com/profile/BradMcCann

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09-23-2008, 05:12 AM	#3 (permalink)
xmicro_Redline Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New York Posts: 4,480 My Photos: (1)	Maybe some of the more technical members may correct me, but if I am not mistaken, the computer does need to "learn" the specifics of the engine. Maybe since you babied it, it had yet to read a max boost. The computer probably just had to adjust so you cannot keep reaching the higher boost. The factory programing is always super safe, so you get more life out of the car. I know some members get more HP out of an aftermarket tune by increasing the boost, but of course that shortens the life of the turbo. I would not worry unless it happens again. These cars are so computer centric. When I first got the car, I drove around with around 1500 miles on it, I parked it, and when I went to restart it it would not start. I waited 10 minutes and it started. That NEVER happened again and I now have over 10,000 miles and 1 and 1/2 years later. So it is possible it made the adjustment and that is it! Good Luck and welcome to the forum!

09-23-2008, 04:27 PM	#9 (permalink)
SCVanguard Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 188 My Photos: (0)	Sorry Wes...the format bug bit me. I was asking that when you started your car and had that issue, was your car on a level street or was the car angled in some fashion? In my case where I had the issue you described, my passenger side wheels were up on a curb, thus putting the car at a ~20* angle slanting toward the driver side. __________________ Brad 2008 Sky Redline Chili Pepper Red Automatic 18" chrome Monsoon Spoiler Stubby RPI GT Exhaust, Downpipe, IC, and tune http://www.imsaturn.com/profile/BradMcCann

09-23-2008, 05:21 PM	#10 (permalink)
cfjara Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 259 My Photos: (0)	check for loose turbo/ intercooler hoses. __________________ 2008 Sky Redline Onyx Black / Black&Tan Interior Spoiler / Chrome Wheels Monsoon Audio w/ 6Disk changer

09-24-2008, 01:47 AM	#12 (permalink)
MataguaySky Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: San Diego Posts: 49 My Photos: (0)	Fyi I have found with my 08' RL Auto is that you do not want to stomp it to WOT. You hit it 2/3 to 3/4 throttle for maybe 1/2 second to let it rev a bit then push it all the way down. Also mine will boost anytime and any speed with enough pedal. __________________ ================== 2008 RL Bluestone GM CAI (or HAI, if you prefer) GM 3'' Cat Back Exhaust Opel GT Antenna KappaRoo KappaBrella

09-24-2008, 09:18 AM	#16 (permalink)
cfjara Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 259 My Photos: (0)	when playing around.....i found my turbo to redline and throw an overboost code when psi hit 26 for over a few seconds. I think 25 is the grey area. __________________ 2008 Sky Redline Onyx Black / Black&Tan Interior Spoiler / Chrome Wheels Monsoon Audio w/ 6Disk changer

09-24-2008, 05:07 PM	#17 (permalink)
Bogie Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Northern, VA Posts: 2,476 My Photos: (0)	Mine launches like a bat out of hell with the 1/2, 3/4, WOT. And this is from dead idle, as opposed to brake and go. I would really like to have a track day where I could test this against the brake and go. The strong first gear before the turbo kicks in full is nice because it's strong enough for a solid launch but not too strong to spin the wheels. I don't know if this is by design or serendipity, but it seems like the gearing is near perfect in giving bottom end pre-turbo gearing torque followed by the power band transition to turbo torque. I haven't looked at the DIC boost gauge, but I don't need to...because I can feel the Newton gauge in the seat...and that's all I really care about. __________________ 2008 Redline Black Onyx Black/Red Leather Monsoon 6 Disc Spoiler French Transmission Born July 2007 Snagged 8/31/07 Belle? That's my car Alizée? That's my avatar Me? Forty something male skydriver

10-21-2008, 04:27 PM	#18 (permalink)
Wolfheart Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mountains in So. Cal. Posts: 58 My Photos: (0)	Sounds like the problem I had when the wastegate mod was made, it would boost up more than stock, up to 24 or 25psi, it would then set off a code and the dar would go into "safe" mode, meaning little (4 or 5 psi) then go to nothing, this woudl last until I turned the car off, then if I got on it a little boost would come on and then quickly go back to safe mode. To fix the problem I backed off the mod to close to where the factory had it, boost maxes now at maybe 18 or 19psi, but it doesn't throw a code now and doesn't go into safe mode. It is an easy fix, takes maybe 5 to 10 minutes depending upon how quickly you can get the heatshield for the turbo off. __________________ Black 2008 Sky RL, red interior.

10-21-2008, 04:35 PM	#19 (permalink)
Wolfheart Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mountains in So. Cal. Posts: 58 My Photos: (0)	Oh, one other thing, if the wastegate control arm is not secure in it's position, meaning either the front or rear nut is lose, the arm will move and when it moves far enough it will boost up and throw the overboost code under heavy acceleration, at other times it will be fine, only way to check this is look under the turbo heatshield, if the nut on one side of the wastegate control arm is down away from the arm then it is moving and that is the problem, just tighten the bolt up to the arm and make sure both sides(nuts on either side) are tight. __________________ Black 2008 Sky RL, red interior.