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Old 03-15-2017, 02:28 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Really Bad News

Well, since I was having no success in fixing my overheating issue after installing the check-valves and replacing the thermostat, I took it to the dealer and they just told me the water pump did indeed fail and when it did, it also took out the chain that went to the shaft balancer also damaging that beyond repair. Their recommendation is replacing the engine at $9200! Told them I can get an engine a lot less than that and to button it back up. So is ZZP the best place to get an engine? Anyone have experience with anyone else?
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Old 03-15-2017, 02:32 PM   #2 (permalink)
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The water pump failed and destroyed the engine?

Has that ever happened to anyone here before?

This forum's members have had more water pump failures than we can count, and I don't remember anyone else having this issue.
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Old 03-15-2017, 03:12 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Did they take pics? If it isn't buttoned up, have them take good pics so you can inspect the damage and make the call yourself.
ZZP looks like about the best price today.
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Old 03-15-2017, 04:02 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Really sorry to hear that TexSon. That sucks.

Trying to remember if that chain connects to the cams but I think it's just on the balance shafts...which I don't think it breaking would, in and of itself, ruin the engine. Now if those pieces of metal get circulated in the oil...which could very well happen...then yea, the engine may need replacement.

BUT, for that amount, you could pull that engine and rebuild it with all forged internals, some new cams, new valves, heavier springs, and still come in at under that price.

As for where to get your engine from, I'd call DDM or Werks before I'd call ZZP. One of the members here got an engine from them and while it eventually worked out in the end, it was not a pleasurable experience in the least. Without getting into too much detail, suffice to say I deal with ZZP only as a very very very last resort.
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Old 03-15-2017, 05:44 PM   #5 (permalink)
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There's two chains in the front of the engine. One connects the water pump and the two balance shafts. The other does the camshafts.

I suppose it is possible for a water pump to do what they've said, but I also think it's highly unlikely or we would have heard of other instances. To me it sounds like a lot of jive talk from the dealer to get you to cough up a wad a cash.

Does the engine run?

I'd get another diagnostic from a different dealer if possible.

I'm a sceptic most of the time. Did they take pictures of the damage?



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Old 03-15-2017, 06:02 PM   #6 (permalink)
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With Dave on this one. You'd think if the chain went you'd have heard it. When those break, it's LOUD. I'd think it would have been a loud bang then something like $20 in quarters in an operating clothes dryer.
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Old 03-15-2017, 06:37 PM   #7 (permalink)
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It's tough to follow, but here's an image of the front of the engine:



2008 Pontiac Solstice Base ENGINE ASM-2.0L L4 PART 3 TIMING CHAIN & TENSIONER
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Old 03-15-2017, 07:13 PM   #8 (permalink)
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171 is the chain in question.
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Old 03-15-2017, 07:38 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Brand new LNF engine, being sold by ZZP, on Ebay right now for $3400 or best offer plus $300 shipping.
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Old 03-15-2017, 08:02 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
171 is the chain in question.
205 looks to be the sprocket that attaches to the water pump, the sprockets for the balance shafts are not shown but you can see from the shape of the chain where those two sprockets would be . . .



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Old 03-15-2017, 09:57 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Here is a slightly more complete diagram.
Attached Thumbnails
Really Bad News-08-09-754-lnf-timing-chain.jpg   Really Bad News-08-09-755-lnf-timing-chain.jpg  
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Old 03-15-2017, 11:34 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Johny125 View Post
Brand new LNF engine, being sold by ZZP, on Ebay right now for $3400 or best offer plus $300 shipping.
If you have the right machine shop I'd rather build the engine he has for that price. Of course, I have a good machine shop that does good work for reasonable prices and not everyone does.

If you get the engine from ZZP, be sure to try and verify what car it came out of. Also, research the differences between the transverse mounted LNF and the longitudinally mounted LNF. I want to say it's head and oil cooler but not 100% sure on that.
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:30 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I am seeing this in the dreaded and much talked about Blue Forum!!!!!

I am guessing you are talking about SkyPilots problems with ZZP. I certainly would PM him and see what he has to say. I know it took a while to get it fixed correctly, and the fact that it was rolling around in the back of a deliver truck did not help.
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Old 03-16-2017, 05:55 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Hmmm should i also start to worry? Lately i am hearing a sound when i accelerate just like i did with my old cars when the belt was wet (it almost sounds like an electronic sound and doesn't last for long).
Any chance this has anything to do with these chains ? (offtopic i know).
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Old 03-16-2017, 08:27 AM   #15 (permalink)
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From what I can figure, and the mechanic wasn't there when I picked the car up, the water pump is not working, and since it is not leaking, that means internal failure. Thus the chain break, and broken chains do nasty things, and although the car is still running, for how long is anyone's guess. So my speculation is, that in-order to replace the failed parts, they will have to rebuild the engine. With 110K miles, well the dealer is not into rebuilt/re-manufactured engines, only new. Thus the cost. Yeah, the LNF is right up there in cost with a LS V-8 which is really outrageous. But then again, a S&S V-twin is also right up there with the LS. Go figure... So I called a couple of shops and the price to rebuild mine is $5K. Yikes! So I will get a rebuilt and if I can find a shop to put it in at a reasonable price I will do that, and they want an arm and leg to replace it, I will do it myself, which will take more time.
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