BSR Tune Stage 2 and Stage 3

phillyredline · 08-25-2007, 02:19 PM

I got an email response from BSR in regards to my question of whether they are coming out with a stage 2 and stage 3 tune for the redline and there answer was YES. This is good new for us with the tune and those thinking about getting it . They said to sign up for their newsletter for the announcement of when they are released. They gave no timeframe.

skyonpsi · 08-25-2007, 06:01 PM

Good news indeed! Thats why I'm glad I purchased their tune, they seem to be several steps ahead of everyone else and thei reputation is unmatched>

BlueSkyRL · 08-25-2007, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skyonpsi

Good news indeed! Thats why I'm glad I purchased their tune, they seem to be several steps ahead of everyone else and thei reputation is unmatched>

I would agree that they seem to be ahead of the game on our tunes too. I'm waiting for someone to dyno the BSR....anyone???

mystein · 08-25-2007, 10:51 PM

I'm a GXP driver but I'm running the BSR Tune along with a K&N Drop-in Air Filter and a Solo Street/Race Catback exhaust system. I'm planning to have a dyno test done a week from today (09/01/2007) at MC Racing in Merriam, KS on their DynoJet.

lil goat · 08-26-2007, 01:50 PM

The Dynojet will give skewed numbers but at least it will be something. Dynojets are inertia dyno's the eddy current are more accurate and what most have been done on for comparison. The Dyno Dynamics is an eddy current dyno. BUT ANYTHING IS BETTER THAN NOTHING. I would expect to see in the 260 to 270 range on a Dynojet. they show in the 240 range for stock. The Dyno Dynamics are in the 206-210 for stock.

Drivetime · 08-26-2007, 07:21 PM

Here's a Dyno sheet from BSR's website. Pretty significant gains showing. Of course, I don't have much experience reading Dyno results (from the crank?).... and it is from their own site. Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't a tune allow the full potential of cat-back and CAI's etc. to be recognized and not adjusted for like with the stock ECU nanny?

Link to BSR page:http://en.bsrab.se/products/t1126/

Skykid · 08-27-2007, 01:52 PM

This is really tempting but I am very wary of tunes like this. My friend is a tech at saturn and also a car enthusiast. He own's an evo 8 and we talk a lot about these types of tunes. You will void your warranty. Saturn knows that these tunes are out there and they will definitely scan your ECM if you blow your engine or kill your turbo. I just wonder what they are doing to get these increases in power. The problem for me is that there is no real information available about these tunes. I am going to wait until someone has a better understanding of what parameters are being changed in the computer to get these numbers. You guys with the tunes just take it easy on the rest of us until we catch up!

skyonpsi · 08-27-2007, 04:12 PM

You have to realize that the majority of us that have these tunes already know this and are willing to take the risk! Those that aren't, should not! It is strictly a personal decision.

Skykid · 08-27-2007, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skyonpsi

You have to realize that the majority of us that have these tunes already know this and are willing to take the risk! Those that aren't, should not! It is strictly a personal decision.

Just making sure that anyone on the fence has all the info. Personally I would love to have one of the tunes but only after I see some numbers. Meaning how much they advance timing, AFR's, and such. 22 PSI is really high for these little turbos and way above their rated operating efficiency. Good luck to all though.

lil goat · 08-27-2007, 05:23 PM

Seems very odd to me they are showing a flywheel dyno on there website, the only way to get this is with the ingine out of the car. they know no one can challenge it as none of us are going to pull our motors. I want to see some real dyno sheets on an eddy current dyno. I am not sure how they are getting the numbers they are with the piece of crap stock intercooler. Everyone loves the tune it seems, I wonder if the ECM will tone it down any, you can see a big HP increase just unplugging your ECM but it doesn't last. BSR has a lot to gain doing this right several new GM vehicles will be using the 2.0 turbo.

Drivetime · 08-27-2007, 07:20 PM

This may be a better representation of the BSR results. (taken from a post in the Solstice forum)

"Here is the dyno chart for a 2007 Saturn Sky Redline (manual trans) that we tested last week. The vehicle realized a 48.86 (22.35%) horsepower gain in fourth gear. The owner of this vehicle is ecstatic with the result. An early (today)Hahn RaceCraft BSR Tuner review on this forum was very positive as well."

lil goat · 08-28-2007, 11:47 PM

That is about what I expected on a Dynojet, I look forward to seeing it on a Dyno Dynamics. That sheet is very confusing, why not a HP Vs. Rpm pull in
4th. Sure would be easier to read.

Drivetime · 08-29-2007, 07:14 AM

I saw that the Lyndon tune with your set up is putting out pretty much the same as the BSR tune (other than the BSR 7K redline). But you have added a larger intercooler and sport exhaust (possibly intake too?).

Do you or any of the other folks with the Lyndon tune have access to a Dyno on an unmodified GXP with the Lyndon tune to see how it compares apples to apples to the BSR (stock GXP) tune results?

Drivetime · 08-31-2007, 07:13 PM

Does anyone have a Lyndon tune on a stock set up that will share Dyno results?

Antonio · 08-31-2007, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snookwheel

Does anyone have a Lyndon tune on a stock set up that will share Dyno results?

lil goat's dyno from the lydon tune was done prior to him getting the intercooler. So those results are pretty much just on Exhaust....without boost modification might I add. I'm very interested to see what Westers garage can do once they can manipulate the boost as well.

Drivetime · 08-31-2007, 07:48 PM

Thanks Antonio, from reading all the threads, it was confusing what mods, if any, were included on the Lyndon tune.

Lil Goat, was there any mods at all? ie intake etc..I am trying to get a handle which tune is giving the biggest gain / $$ return. If the Dyno was done stock, pls repost the results. Thanks

Antonio · 08-31-2007, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snookwheel

Thanks Antonio, from reading all the threads, it was confusing what mods, if any, were included on the Lyndon tune.

Lil Goat, was there any mods at all? ie intake etc..I am trying to get a handle which tune is giving the biggest gain / $$ return. If the Dyno was done stock, pls repost the results. Thanks

as of right now, it's really hard to tell which is better bang for the buck. Considering both are still being tweaked. As of right now, in my opinion, it's westers garage. He's acheiving just about the same hp and torque as BSR but without raising the boost. If he raised the boost a bit, I'm sure the car would be as powerful, or even more powerful than BSR. But there's other things you have to consider. The ease of BSR is nice vs. sending out your ECM,etc. It's a hard decision. I'm really close to just buying the BSR, but I know I should probably at least wait to see what lydon can do. It just sucks being on the fence and not knowing which way to go.

Morfious · 08-31-2007, 10:00 PM

If the BSR tune was $600 it would be a no brainer. Launch control, higher red-line, ability to upgrade and reflash to stock at will all seem fantastic. I'm just not sure those features are worth an extra $500. Performance seems to be great from both and I do like the features of the BSR tune a bit better, but the price is a bit daunting.

Antonio · 08-31-2007, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morfious

If the BSR tune was $600 it would be a no brainer. Launch control, higher red-line, ability to upgrade and reflash to stock at will all seem fantastic. I'm just not sure those features are worth an extra $500. Performance seems to be great from both and I do like the features of the BSR tune a bit better, but the price is a bit daunting.

well, there's also the question of can the engine really take that 7K redline. I'd feel more comfortable with a 6500 or 6700 redline myself. And with the lydon, i do believe it can be made back to stock with HP Tuner software, which is what I believe he's using. I haven't really talked to him about details, which I've been meaning to do.

The launch control feature is definitely cool though.

Drivetime · 08-31-2007, 10:14 PM

I understand that

But I have yet to see a 'stock to stock' comparison. The real question I am looking for an answer to is: Is there a dyno available to compare the CURRENT Lyndon tune on a stock GXP vs a stock GXP with the CURRENT BSR tune?? That, is what could be a deciding factor for many of us.

SSGTBARCLAY · 09-01-2007, 04:22 PM

I think if it can truely and safely reprogram the ECU to push the Redline over 300 HP I would for sure pay that money.

lil goat · 09-02-2007, 01:28 PM

The only thing on my car when it was dyno'd was the Solo Street Race exhaust and the tune. I tried to do a dyno run after the IC was installed but it was just to hot, 97 and very humid. What we saw before heat soak was the IC made the power come on earlier and it pulled all the way to 6500, but it did drop about 10 hp after 5800 rpm. Last weekend I found the clamp on the hose on the intake (at the head) was loose and leaking boost so my latest results aren't worth much for real numbers but the extended power curve was there. I am not sure if the hose was loose on the first run or not. I now have the Dejon metal intake elbow, seeing quite a bit more low end torque and strangly a little lower boost but more power.
I don't understand the 7000 rpm redline of the BSR, with the stock IC the turbo stops making power at 5800 so I don't know what it buys you other than it's harder to miss the shift. With an upgraded IC you could maybe still make power to 7000 but I doubt it. It also seems very odd to me everyone with the BSR is making 23 lbs of boost, it should vary with altitude and temp unless they some how hard coded the boost controller, as you improve flow ie. exhaust and IC it should go down. Whatever they are doing seems to be very different from what Lyndon is doing. Lyndon is waiting on a new IC for some testing and a new tune on a GXP there in Canada. You do not have to send in your ECM if you don't want to you can buy a second one for $400 from Saturn Motorsports, then for $895 you have a tuned and stock ecm. Just takes a minute to swap them.

08-25-2007, 02:19 PM	#1 (permalink)
phillyredline Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 40 My Photos: (0)	BSR Tune Stage 2 and Stage 3 I got an email response from BSR in regards to my question of whether they are coming out with a stage 2 and stage 3 tune for the redline and there answer was YES. This is good new for us with the tune and those thinking about getting it . They said to sign up for their newsletter for the announcement of when they are released. They gave no timeframe. __________________ 07 SkyRedline Auto RPI GT Exhaust K&N Filter RPI Stage 2 Intercooler BSR ECU Tune

08-26-2007, 01:50 PM	#5 (permalink)
lil goat Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 237 My Photos: (0)	The Dynojet will give skewed numbers but at least it will be something. Dynojets are inertia dyno's the eddy current are more accurate and what most have been done on for comparison. The Dyno Dynamics is an eddy current dyno. BUT ANYTHING IS BETTER THAN NOTHING. I would expect to see in the 260 to 270 range on a Dynojet. they show in the 240 range for stock. The Dyno Dynamics are in the 206-210 for stock. __________________ "It's better to burn out than it is to rust"

08-26-2007, 07:21 PM	#6 (permalink)
Drivetime Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 76 My Photos: (0)	Here's a Dyno sheet from BSR's website. Pretty significant gains showing. Of course, I don't have much experience reading Dyno results (from the crank?).... and it is from their own site. Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't a tune allow the full potential of cat-back and CAI's etc. to be recognized and not adjusted for like with the stock ECU nanny? Link to BSR page:http://en.bsrab.se/products/t1126/ Last edited by Drivetime : 08-26-2007 at 07:24 PM.

08-27-2007, 05:23 PM	#10 (permalink)
lil goat Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 237 My Photos: (0)	Seems very odd to me they are showing a flywheel dyno on there website, the only way to get this is with the ingine out of the car. they know no one can challenge it as none of us are going to pull our motors. I want to see some real dyno sheets on an eddy current dyno. I am not sure how they are getting the numbers they are with the piece of crap stock intercooler. Everyone loves the tune it seems, I wonder if the ECM will tone it down any, you can see a big HP increase just unplugging your ECM but it doesn't last. BSR has a lot to gain doing this right several new GM vehicles will be using the 2.0 turbo. __________________ "It's better to burn out than it is to rust"

08-28-2007, 11:47 PM	#12 (permalink)
lil goat Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 237 My Photos: (0)	That is about what I expected on a Dynojet, I look forward to seeing it on a Dyno Dynamics. That sheet is very confusing, why not a HP Vs. Rpm pull in 4th. Sure would be easier to read. __________________ "It's better to burn out than it is to rust"

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08-25-2007, 06:01 PM	#2 (permalink)
skyonpsi Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: charlotte nc Posts: 103 My Photos: (0)	Good news indeed! Thats why I'm glad I purchased their tune, they seem to be several steps ahead of everyone else and thei reputation is unmatched>

08-25-2007, 10:51 PM	#4 (permalink)
mystein Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 6 My Photos: (0)	I'm a GXP driver but I'm running the BSR Tune along with a K&N Drop-in Air Filter and a Solo Street/Race Catback exhaust system. I'm planning to have a dyno test done a week from today (09/01/2007) at MC Racing in Merriam, KS on their DynoJet.

08-27-2007, 01:52 PM	#7 (permalink)
Skykid Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Melbourne, FL Posts: 127 My Photos: (0)	This is really tempting but I am very wary of tunes like this. My friend is a tech at saturn and also a car enthusiast. He own's an evo 8 and we talk a lot about these types of tunes. You will void your warranty. Saturn knows that these tunes are out there and they will definitely scan your ECM if you blow your engine or kill your turbo. I just wonder what they are doing to get these increases in power. The problem for me is that there is no real information available about these tunes. I am going to wait until someone has a better understanding of what parameters are being changed in the computer to get these numbers. You guys with the tunes just take it easy on the rest of us until we catch up!

08-27-2007, 04:12 PM	#8 (permalink)
skyonpsi Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: charlotte nc Posts: 103 My Photos: (0)	You have to realize that the majority of us that have these tunes already know this and are willing to take the risk! Those that aren't, should not! It is strictly a personal decision.

08-27-2007, 07:20 PM	#11 (permalink)
Drivetime Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 76 My Photos: (0)	This may be a better representation of the BSR results. (taken from a post in the Solstice forum) "Here is the dyno chart for a 2007 Saturn Sky Redline (manual trans) that we tested last week. The vehicle realized a 48.86 (22.35%) horsepower gain in fourth gear. The owner of this vehicle is ecstatic with the result. An early (today)Hahn RaceCraft BSR Tuner review on this forum was very positive as well."

08-29-2007, 07:14 AM	#13 (permalink)
Drivetime Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 76 My Photos: (0)	I saw that the Lyndon tune with your set up is putting out pretty much the same as the BSR tune (other than the BSR 7K redline). But you have added a larger intercooler and sport exhaust (possibly intake too?). Do you or any of the other folks with the Lyndon tune have access to a Dyno on an unmodified GXP with the Lyndon tune to see how it compares apples to apples to the BSR (stock GXP) tune results?

08-31-2007, 07:13 PM	#14 (permalink)
Drivetime Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 76 My Photos: (0)	Does anyone have a Lyndon tune on a stock set up that will share Dyno results?

08-31-2007, 07:48 PM	#16 (permalink)
Drivetime Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 76 My Photos: (0)	Thanks Antonio, from reading all the threads, it was confusing what mods, if any, were included on the Lyndon tune. Lil Goat, was there any mods at all? ie intake etc..I am trying to get a handle which tune is giving the biggest gain / $$ return. If the Dyno was done stock, pls repost the results. Thanks

08-31-2007, 10:00 PM	#18 (permalink)
Morfious Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Central NJ Posts: 289 My Photos: (0)	If the BSR tune was $600 it would be a no brainer. Launch control, higher red-line, ability to upgrade and reflash to stock at will all seem fantastic. I'm just not sure those features are worth an extra $500. Performance seems to be great from both and I do like the features of the BSR tune a bit better, but the price is a bit daunting. __________________ Mean GXP Delivered 1/30/2007 $MSRP +$2K My Stereo Install--> Ultimate Pioneer Avic D3 Install Thread Mods: Solo-Performance Street Race exhaust Debadged JPM interior & shifter O.Z. Ultraleggera DDM Works Big Brake Kit Dunlop DZ 101

09-02-2007, 01:35 PM	#23 (permalink)
Antonio Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: South Plainfield, New Jersey Posts: 1,651 My Photos: (6)

08-31-2007, 10:14 PM	#20 (permalink)
Drivetime Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 76 My Photos: (0)	I understand that But I have yet to see a 'stock to stock' comparison. The real question I am looking for an answer to is: Is there a dyno available to compare the CURRENT Lyndon tune on a stock GXP vs a stock GXP with the CURRENT BSR tune?? That, is what could be a deciding factor for many of us. Last edited by Drivetime : 08-31-2007 at 10:19 PM.

09-01-2007, 04:22 PM	#21 (permalink)
SSGTBARCLAY Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 186 My Photos: (14)	I think if it can truely and safely reprogram the ECU to push the Redline over 300 HP I would for sure pay that money. __________________ 2007 Red Sky Redline (Doing It Topless!!!) -Eibach Sportline Lowering Springs -Pioneer AVIC-D3 DVD/GPS/Bluetooth/IPOD -RPi GT Series Exhaust, RPi Intercooler Stage 2, RPi Down Pipe http://www.imsaturn.com/profile/William

09-02-2007, 01:28 PM	#22 (permalink)
lil goat Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 237 My Photos: (0)	The only thing on my car when it was dyno'd was the Solo Street Race exhaust and the tune. I tried to do a dyno run after the IC was installed but it was just to hot, 97 and very humid. What we saw before heat soak was the IC made the power come on earlier and it pulled all the way to 6500, but it did drop about 10 hp after 5800 rpm. Last weekend I found the clamp on the hose on the intake (at the head) was loose and leaking boost so my latest results aren't worth much for real numbers but the extended power curve was there. I am not sure if the hose was loose on the first run or not. I now have the Dejon metal intake elbow, seeing quite a bit more low end torque and strangly a little lower boost but more power. I don't understand the 7000 rpm redline of the BSR, with the stock IC the turbo stops making power at 5800 so I don't know what it buys you other than it's harder to miss the shift. With an upgraded IC you could maybe still make power to 7000 but I doubt it. It also seems very odd to me everyone with the BSR is making 23 lbs of boost, it should vary with altitude and temp unless they some how hard coded the boost controller, as you improve flow ie. exhaust and IC it should go down. Whatever they are doing seems to be very different from what Lyndon is doing. Lyndon is waiting on a new IC for some testing and a new tune on a GXP there in Canada. You do not have to send in your ECM if you don't want to you can buy a second one for $400 from Saturn Motorsports, then for $895 you have a tuned and stock ecm. Just takes a minute to swap them. __________________ "It's better to burn out than it is to rust"