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Old 09-11-2012, 10:17 PM   #1 (permalink)
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EFR turbo

Anyone else notice that the BW EFR turbo is now a bolt-on upgrade available through zzp? Supposedly achieved 540 whp on E85. Very tempting. I am thinking about upgrading and selling my FP kit.
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Old 09-11-2012, 10:27 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Werks has a full kit too.

Problem is getting an EFR.
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Old 09-11-2012, 10:50 PM   #3 (permalink)
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ZZP has them in stock and they are for sale today. This is a full bolt on with no adapters but they have not checked fitment on Kappa's yet. I asked them to measure for me to see if it will fit.
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Old 09-11-2012, 11:13 PM   #4 (permalink)
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So it's a K04/EFR hybrid with the exhaust being from the stock turbo.
As such
I'd want to see Some proof of their numbers
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Old 09-12-2012, 01:21 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Been running the Trifecta E47 tune for 2 months and love it. My tuner was raving about ZFR. Read about it on the Cobalt forum and I am IN! My birthday is in November and I got the wife on board. I had been feeling her out lately quoting that $3K price tag ZZP had. When I said it was going on sale at $1900, game over. She loves a sale... the fish is in the boat.

http://www.cobaltss.net/forums/2-0l-...d-ever-244457/
http://shop.zzperformance.com/store/...ZFR-Turbo.aspx

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Old 09-12-2012, 05:50 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae View Post
Anyone else notice that the BW EFR turbo is now a bolt-on upgrade available through zzp? Supposedly achieved 540 whp on E85. Very tempting. I am thinking about upgrading and selling my FP kit.
the 540whp on E85 is an inflated number from a vendor who will use whatever modifications to "achieve" that number. I'm not sure if a regular customer car will get that # just by simply bolting that kit and using E85.

plus of course, the # for a fwd car.

it will be lower with a rwd.


with the zfr using a stock turbo housing.............which will be the limiting factor for whp
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Old 09-12-2012, 09:04 AM   #7 (permalink)
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With the 6758 your not going to getting 540whp. You'll be in the 480 Max with an aggressive and all supporting mods(ie cams, 5th injector etc). Just bolting on you see 410-420whp.
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Old 09-12-2012, 09:58 AM   #8 (permalink)
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keeping an eye on this thread
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Old 09-12-2012, 10:53 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by DirtyMike View Post
keeping an eye on this thread

Mike you already have a garrett exhaust manifold......with all the internal goodies!

You just need a bigger turbo (gt2871r or gt3071/76r), lines, adapter, and you're good to go!!!

no need to get a zfr turbo
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:18 AM   #10 (permalink)
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They are already selling this with a bunch of false information.
There is no way in hell they will get the numbers they are stated with it being just a bolt on.

We have plenty of experience with E85 to know there will be a fueling issue. Solving that, I guess if you want to use the ZZP craptastic 5th injector would technically be a bolt on, but you need to add a controller and some good tuning.

They of course don't advertise that they used a 5th injector to get their power levels but do mention some NON BOLT on mods.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt of ZZP
We took all of this and added:
Bolt-on to LNF manifold
LNF exit for factory O2 housing
Re-designed wastegate actuator bracket for use in this application
Adapter fitting for factory LNF oil inlet hose

This setup uses our off-the shelf charge tubes, intercooler, downpipe, etc... It also has a stock airbox and our silicone intake coupler with a slight modification.
In order to make their product sound great, Matt made the following claim in regards to the BNR turbo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt of ZZP
I don't want to sound like a dick, but probably will by saying this- This turbo is WAY out of the league of what they are offering. Their setup simply squeezes slightly larger wheels into the factory turbo. Gains are possible, but minimal.
This is COMPLETELY INCORRECT
The BNR turbo is NOT a big wheel upgrade of the K04. In the BNR turbo, The LNF K04 turbine housing is machined for the GT28 CHRA.
The ZFR follows a similar design uses an EFR compressor vs a Garrett one.

The stock non ZZP kit EFR has a 53.9mm Inducer wheel with a 49lb/min max flow rate
The 2871 has a 53.2MM inducer wheel with a 45lb/min max flow rate

So if a 53.2 MM Inducer wheel will only produce minimal results, how much more will you get with an inducer wheel that is only .7mm bigger?

Don't believe all the hype over at the Cobalt SS Cult.
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:35 AM   #11 (permalink)
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All I can, and feel I should say here is BE CAREFUL.

Anyone that knows me knows how I feel about ZZP. In one short statement, they're a company with decent ideas but horrible follow-through.

I've known about the "ZFR" for over a year, damn I think it might be getting closer to a year and a half Antonio? I made a comment about it back then and called it "VaporWare". Computer geeks out there will know what that means, basically a product that a company hypes but never really comes to fruition as a viable, available product. No ZZP clan members jumped all over me, then waited patiently for over a year and still had nothing. Many of the guys that were ready to buy when ZZP first announced it don't even own a Cobalt anymore!

The "ZFR" turbo is a stock EFR center section, put into a turbine housing that ZZP had a foundry cast. I don't think anyone has ever found out who that foundry is, I don't believe it's Borg Warner themselves that have cast the housing. If it's not a Borg Warner casting, I would NO WAY IN H#LL put it on my car. Casting a turbine housing is not something that is easy to do. Actually, casting it is easy, making sure it doesn't self-destruct after a couple heat cycles is the hard part!

My advice on the "ZFR", wait and see how it lasts before jumping on it. I would definitely recommend a 2871 hybrid over the ZFR at this point. Like I said above, it's a cool idea, but ZZP is the king of doing things half @ssed and causing MAJOR problems, then blaming it on the customer so they don't have to pay warranty claims.
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:48 AM   #12 (permalink)
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about 2 years of ZFR turbo preview......

just like my compound turbo build preview.....lol
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:56 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elff View Post
They are already selling this with a bunch of false information.
There is no way in hell they will get the numbers they are stated with it being just a bolt on.
And even if you could, how long do you think the engine internals would last at that level ('bolt on' means bolting that mod on and nothing else, normally).....
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Old 09-12-2012, 12:01 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Excellent Point Bill
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Old 09-12-2012, 12:24 PM   #15 (permalink)
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lol, found my post saying I thought it would be vaporware. That comment was almost a year and a half ago. The Cobalt kids thought I was such an @ss to question the great ZZP, but it took them almost 2 years to bring that product to market. My comment might have been harsh and kind of smart @ss, but it was accurate. The reason I made those comments is I KNEW there would be guys waiting for that product for a very long time and felt bad that they didn't realize it. There were lots of guys that could have gone a different route and been happy and driving their cars, instead ZZP made them hold their breath for almost 2 years. To me that's horrible business practice, and a cruel, unfair thing to do to your customers. They kept those guys on the hook and waiting for all that time, and still we don't know for sure if this setup is even going to last without major disasters.

BTW, if you read through a few pages before and after this page, I think the question was asked about who's casting the turbine housing. It's NOT Borg Warner, and they never admitted or said who actually was doing the casting or what it's even cast out of. I was the only one that even noticed that the pictures they showed in the first page weren't even of an EFR turbo, and that the turbine housing had been cut, welded together, bead blasted and then painted. NOBODY EVEN NOTICED THAT! ZZP's market is very different than most, all they have to impress is some kids driving Cobalts.

ZZP Builds The Best LNF Mod Ever! - Page 20 - Cobalt SS Network
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