headers

[lbsky]

What is the main advantage or disadvantage between shorty or long tube headers

[SaturnSkyDude]

I think the shorty header allows you to keep the stock exhaust and the long header requires more modification.

[lbsky]

Originally Posted by SaturnSkyDude

I think the shorty header allows you to keep the stock exhaust and the long header requires more modification.

this is correct, I am just wondering about power, is there a difference Meaning is one better for upper RPM power and the other more for torque. Thanks for the help

[Valistener]

Long tubes tend to give you more power than the shorty headers. The one problem in F-bodies was that if you got long tubes, you better not lower the car because long tubes tend to hang lower.

[Devil Dog]

Our shorty header bolts directly to the stock converter and can be installed in an hour or less. The mid to higher RPM range is where it shines as it uses a 4 into 1 design.

Our long tube TRI-Y is designed to build more torque down low and will produce power to 5500 rpm before it starts tapering off. But, it requires the installation of a hi-flow cat converter. The stock exhaust system needs to be cut and then our system slips into the stock slip joint and can be clamped or welded.

The Long tube TRI-Y is definitely louder and is more of a raspy sound. A resonator may be desired.

Both the long and short header allow the engine to rev much more freely, add HP and torque, shed weight from the car and change the sound.

I hope this helps.

[jb151]

Originally Posted by Valistener

Long tubes tend to give you more power than the shorty headers. The one problem in F-bodies was that if you got long tubes, you better not lower the car because long tubes tend to hang lower.

The main problem on the fbodies was long tubes required you to modify the location of the catalytic converter which made them illegal in certain states. But yes they provided a lot more power...shorties were barely worth the hassle/money.

[Valistener]

Originally Posted by jb151

The main problem on the fbodies was long tubes required you to modify the location of the catalytic converter which made them illegal in certain states. But yes they provided a lot more power...shorties were barely worth the hassle/money.

Thats why you just leave the cats off entirely.

[MidniteBlues]

Originally Posted by Valistener

Thats why you just leave the cats off entirely.

Now thats definitely illegal in ALL states

BUT if you think about it, there are many many old, relics, rebuilt, cars out on the road that were built without a cat--whats the difference? Perhaps in our case if we leave the cat off, and something goes wrong with the warranty, kiss the warranty good-bye--For the moment, its not something I want to lose just yet--On the other hand, many states test cars emissions--that will getcha--luckily here in florida that dumb test has been eliminated, BUT when in force IF you failed? no registration and NO tags--Without that piece of paper that said PASS, no re-newal, had to make repairs, prove repairs, finally re-test to check it-at a small additional fee of course-

[TCASON]

Originally Posted by Valistener

Thats why you just leave the cats off entirely.

Leaving the cat off these cars is not necessary with our high flow replacement. Unless someone is doing a visual inspection and knows what they are actually looking for, will never know, as our high flow converter will pass all emissions and it is in the stock location.
Eliminating the cat will throw a engine check light, guaranteed! and the car will go into limp mode, not fun.

[Valistener]

Originally Posted by TCASON

Leaving the cat off these cars is not necessary with our high flow replacement. Unless someone is doing a visual inspection and knows what they are actually looking for, will never know, as our high flow converter will pass all emissions and it is in the stock location.
Eliminating the cat will throw a engine check light, guaranteed! and the car will go into limp mode, not fun.

Kansas does not have any inspection on any sort. When I was in Michigan I knew a great many F-body and stang owners that ran strait pipes. With aftermarket cats like yours the gains from completely removing them are becoming less and less. Though there would still be less weight and less restriction.
What sensor would cause the car to go into limp home mode?

[MidniteBlues]

Originally Posted by TCASON

Leaving the cat off these cars is not necessary with our high flow replacement. Unless someone is doing a visual inspection and knows what they are actually looking for, will never know, as our high flow converter will pass all emissions and it is in the stock location.
Eliminating the cat will throw a engine check light, guaranteed! and the car will go into limp mode, not fun.

You guys finally receive the studs? If so, does this cat marry well to magnaflows dual exhaust system. My goal is to marry the 2-early next year--(after christmas)-when I have some money again--

[ggccg]

Originally Posted by MidniteBlues

Now thats definitely illegal in ALL states

BUT if you think about it, there are many many old, relics, rebuilt, cars out on the road that were built without a cat--whats the difference? Perhaps in our case if we leave the cat off, and something goes wrong with the warranty, kiss the warranty good-bye--For the moment, its not something I want to lose just yet--On the other hand, many states test cars emissions--that will getcha--luckily here in florida that dumb test has been eliminated, BUT when in force IF you failed? no registration and NO tags--Without that piece of paper that said PASS, no re-newal, had to make repairs, prove repairs, finally re-test to check it-at a small additional fee of course-

Chapter 1200-3-36
Motor Vehicle Tampering
(in regard to emmission control systems)

(3) No person shall perform emission related repairs on any part of a motor vehicle that is in a tampered state unless such repairs are performed that brings the vehicle into compliance with federal motor vehicle standards. This provision applies regardless of the age or mileage of a vehicle that was designed to meet federal motor vehicle standards.

[TCASON]

Originally Posted by Valistener

Kansas does not have any inspection on any sort. When I was in Michigan I knew a great many F-body and stang owners that ran strait pipes. With aftermarket cats like yours the gains from completely removing them are becoming less and less. Though there would still be less weight and less restriction.
What sensor would cause the car to go into limp home mode?

The OBII systems have a a second sensor behind the cat, so if that fails the computer will set of a check engine light and in most cases put the car into limp mode.

Originally Posted by MidniteBlues

You guys finally receive the studs? If so, does this cat marry well to magnaflows dual exhaust system. My goal is to marry the 2-early next year--(after christmas)-when I have some money again--

No not yet, but we have A Sky owner that works at the Redline plant looking into it, so hopefully soon. Yes this will mate up to the Magnaflow perfectly, as the converter ends at the factory location and has the factory style end to it.

Originally Posted by ggccg

Chapter 1200-3-36
Motor Vehicle Tampering
(in regard to emmission control systems)

(3) No person shall perform emission related repairs on any part of a motor vehicle that is in a tampered state unless such repairs are performed that brings the vehicle into compliance with federal motor vehicle standards. This provision applies regardless of the age or mileage of a vehicle that was designed to meet federal motor vehicle standards.

yes tampering with a fully functional system is a no no, but these are sold as an off road use only, but they will pass the strictest emissions test anywhere, sniffer test included
I have heard that when you have at least 60,000 or more miles on a converter, your allowed to replace it, just what I have heard, could be wrong.

[lbsky]

Originally Posted by TCASON

The OBII systems have a a second sensor behind the cat, so if that fails the computer will set of a check engine light and in most cases put the car into limp mode.

No not yet, but we have A Sky owner that works at the Redline plant looking into it, so hopefully soon. Yes this will mate up to the Magnaflow perfectly, as the converter ends at the factory location and has the factory style end to it.


yes tampering with a fully functional system is a no no, but these are sold as an off road use only, but they will pass the strictest emissions test anywhere, sniffer test included
I have heard that when you have at least 60,000 or more miles on a converter, your allowed to replace it, just what I have heard, could be wrong.

Thanks guys.

[jb151]

Just because there are no inspections doesnt make it legal to run no cats. I live in Florida and we don't have inspections either. I had an LS1 with a massive cam, longtubes, no cats, and open cutout. There's so many white trash pickups with no exhaust around here the cops never even cared about my 7000 rpm wide open headers.

As touched on before...the reason older cars do not require cats to be legal is because they were born before Ralph Nader.

[madmods]

Its illegal, just don't get caught!

[Pitcom]

I was pulling into gas station downtown philly when i had my trans am, and my cat got dented from the incline of the skirt. I had to hollow it out to get the car to run properly. I ended up just elaving it that way cause it sounded great.

[natessky]

Let a pro explain. The longer your headers are the better they scavange exhaust out of the heads. This means that with the exhaust pressure as each piston compresses, the vacuum of the next piston "sucks out" , or scavanges, the ehaust. This allows for better fuel economy, power, and sound because you're getting the exhaust gases out faster and getting clean air in the combustion chamber. For a 4cyl the best and most common is a 4-2-1 header configuration. Good headers will usually give you anywhere from 20-40hp (with good exhaust system) depending on how the car breathes. Hope this helps.

[natessky]

Curr ently I have an 88 GTA Firebird. My ehaust consists of Heddman headers, a 3in. pipe to a dynomax flow through muffler and turn down tip. thats all. Illegal as hell but the power and sound are awesome. You can run no cats like me. unlikely you'll get pulled over unless you drive stupid on the street. just save your old cat and bolt back on for smog test. just run the car for about 20 highway miles and youll pass no problem... or you can pay $150 and pass smog no problem, no what i mean?

[lbsky]

Originally Posted by natessky

Curr ently I have an 88 GTA Firebird. My ehaust consists of Heddman headers, a 3in. pipe to a dynomax flow through muffler and turn down tip. thats all. Illegal as hell but the power and sound are awesome. You can run no cats like me. unlikely you'll get pulled over unless you drive stupid on the street. just save your old cat and bolt back on for smog test. just run the car for about 20 highway miles and youll pass no problem... or you can pay $150 and pass smog no problem, no what i mean?

will leaving the cat off cause problems or not I do not want to throw a bunch of codes.

[natessky]

First of all, to answer a previous quote, shorty headers are worth the money. anything flows better than a stock manifold and you can always use mid-length headers if you want to lower the car. My car uses an obd1 computer. its sensitive but easier to trick. a new car will have an obd2. if you have an oxygen sensor after the cat they sell a special relay for gm cars that trick the computer by sending it a false reading. you just connect it in place of the sensor. summit racing and jegs have these. REMEBER, we are talking about a 4cyl car, not a 350 v8. headers and high flow cats will be more than enough for an engine this small.