May be Buying My First New Car Later this Year - Page 3 - Saturn Sky Forums: Saturn Sky Forum
Roadster/Small RWD Market/Other Vehicle General Discussion Discussion about owning, loving, lusting, or coveting roadsters and other small RWD'rs and "other" general vehicle discussion. Competitive vehicles, other "cool drives" and other discussion related to the ownership experience.

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post #31 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-14-2012, 04:46 PM
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LOL I love this kind of discussion.


People buy new things for a lot of different reasons.

I buy used tools, computers, CDs, DVDs, paperback books . . . heck a lot of things I buy used. Like others have said, why pay the "new" tax when you don’t have to?

On the other hand, there are things that I do not buy new. Kleenex. Toilet paper. Newspapers and magazines. Kitchen trash cans. Sandwich bags. You can make your own list in this category.

In the 60s when I first entered the car market, cars were a lot different than today. You saw cars on their last legs every day. Driving down the street with a stream of oil coming out the tail pipe. Relatively new cars were worn out and went far down market after 3-4 years or over 50k miles. A lot of the people making buying decisions in the 60s had grown up with cars from the 30s and 40s that were designed for local travel on what was then called a “highway”.
1908 The first speed limit was 20 mph outside municipalities, 8 mph inside municipalities
1926 35 mph
1940 45 mph
1941 50 mph
12/1/42 Gas rationing and a 35 mph speed limit on all roads that had been in effect along the East Coast for 7 months was extended nationally to conserve gasoline and rubber during World War II
8/15/45 50 mph speed limit reinstated
1958 60 mph daytime, 50 mph speed limit at night
1963 70 mph for cars and 55 mph for trucks and commercial tractors on interstates; 60 mph daytime and 50 nighttime on noninterstates
So cars were designed to be price competitive, “low tech”, travel at most 60 -70 MPH for about 12 K miles a year for 3 years. They were all very similar under the skin and they sold cars based on “style”. They changed the look of their cars year to year enough to generate sales. And since the cars were built to have a very limited life, they also wore out a lot earlier than they do today.

While today we consider 100k miles as easily achievable, in the 50s and 60s a car with 50k miles was considered very high mileage by most. The phrase “nickle and dime you to death” was heard in many a sales room. So with cars being relatively cheaper, less reliable, having a shorter life span, there was a stigma attached to driving an “old” car. In the dawning age of the consumer age, if you had a 5 year old car you must be poor and not have the resources to stay current.

If you are “old” then you might choose to buy a new car over a used one because of the perception that the new car is much more reliable and has more of its available life available.

If you are concerned with image over savings you might buy a new car because its new and sends the “right” message.

There is no right or wrong here. Its personal preferance and resources.

Personally I love when people buy new stuff. You don’t get the used stuff without someone out there buying it new and turning it into used.
said, why pay the "new" tax when you dont have to.
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post #32 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-14-2012, 04:58 PM
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Good post, Rob!

I'm a collector of various things and therefor tend to buy old/used. We have a very active oriental community in Vancouver, many of whom engage in the high end audio hobby, and have to try and outdo their neighbours by owning the latest and greatest gear. That results in a lot of really tasty stuff getting sold here, and the fickleness of audio fashion results in it generally being unloaded a year or two later, in favour of the latest and greatest upgrades.

I think I saved about $4,000 on a turntable that some guy had bought a couple of years before, because he decided that digital was the road for him and he ditched all his analogue gear and replaced it with state of the art digital!

I get the same feeling when I see the one or two year old Jags and Porsches being offered for $20K less than the owners paid for them new (not that I am in the market for such myself - I pretty much stick to dependable old British stuff with the odd Pontiac thrown in for comic relief).

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post #33 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-14-2012, 05:55 PM
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Good post, Rob!

I'm a collector of various things and therefor tend to buy old/used. We have a very active oriental community in Vancouver, many of whom engage in the high end audio hobby, and have to try and outdo their neighbours by owning the latest and greatest gear. That results in a lot of really tasty stuff getting sold here, and the fickleness of audio fashion results in it generally being unloaded a year or two later, in favour of the latest and greatest upgrades.
This is very true in Vancouver and Toronto with the oriental community, I can vouch. As an example, I know of a Benz dealer in Toronto who actually gets a fair amount of cars in breaking their lease after 1 year paying a ton of fees to do so, just to upgrade to the newest model because it's a pearl white instead of electric white, or bluetooth and led fog lamps were added.

So you get a great deal in terms of savings in these markets if you know who to speak to.

Near new, is new to me =)
But really, new vs used is all dependant on the situation, years or the car, etc. Cars are built better then even 10 years ago. There is a lot to figure in, I don't think there is a concrete choice on right vs. wrong here.

I can say, if you turn cars a lot, don't buy new.

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post #34 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-14-2012, 10:49 PM
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The downside of buying used even if you do due diligence

Is my GM bumper to bumper warranty useless? - Page 2 - Pontiac Solstice Forum

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post #35 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-15-2012, 08:45 PM Thread Starter
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I think I just found what I'm gonna wait for. Even if I have to buy new:

Build Your 2013 Ford Mustang[|Ford|Mustang|2013|1|1.|301A.P8C..HD..88U.~YZKAA.4 4X.GT.COU.LESS.55D.43S.]

Gotta have it Green
6-speed manual
Rearco seats
Brembo Brakes
Reverse sensors

HIDs come standard now and so does the leather steering wheel (the steering wheel was my big hang up on the base model 2011-2012s).

It just got real. Can't wait until I get back from Europe and possibly on my new career.

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post #36 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-28-2012, 08:44 AM
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Koobie's smitten!

I can’t say I blame you though. I truly think that Ford has finally back to what the 'stangs used to be.

60s -70s: HELL YEAH!!
80s: there were no real mustangs here
90s: they tried...
2000s: Whoa! The first Ford pony-car-induced boners in like 30 years!

And the newest round... well... it's just good to see they have turned the name back into something Carroll can be proud to have been associated with in its early years.

If I buy another American sports car here in the next few years, it would likely be one of the newest generations of 'stangs.

Caveats:
- I do like the looks of many of the modern Mopar and Chevy offerings.
- Been burnt too many times by terrible Mopar drivetrains
- I’ve always been a Camaro fan. I think they are where Ford was back in 2000-2010. They have a pretty good looking vehicle, but they didn’t really want to take the plunge (on looks or performance). I am really looking forward to seeing where Chevy takes their pony car.

- Used cars versus new cars -

I've been both routes and lived both sides.

Wondering when the cheap piece of crap is going to strand me again, getting my hands dirty making repairs, etc...

vs.

Cringing at every ding, seeing the pristine turn to mundane, depreciation depression, etc...

It's really just about which set of worries you would rather deal with. (shrugs)

Using Honda values does not fully carry over in a discussion regarding Hyundais or Saturns. But that may be a valid point in comparison to the Ford Mustang that Koobie wants.

Hyundai is trying hard to correct the disposable car image that their brand and Kia are known as.

GM vehicle values have taken a major hit from the parent company instabilities and woes.

Ford on the other hand has really made a rep for quality. Be it the reality, or the aggressive marketing campaign, people BELIEVE they are better vehicles. Honda has also established the same reputation. As such, people are willing to pay more for these vehicles on the used market.

My personal example…

We bought my '08 Sky, new from the dealer for ~8-9k more than we paid for our '07 Tundra (used). The Tundra now blue books (private party selling) at about 25K vs the Sky at 18K. Granted, the Tundra started with a 4-5k higher list price, but it still shows the kind of loss you take on new cars and brands that have a poor public image.

Be a part of the solution!
and
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post #37 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 12:46 AM Thread Starter
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Well I pulled the trigger on a car today: 2008 G37S Coupe 6MT w/ 30k miles and a ton of warranty left (32 months / 30k on drivetrain & 8 months / 20K on bumper-to-bumper)

Before I pulled the trigger I thought pretty hard on how much I actually drive hard. I mean, when was the last time I went drag racing? 2008. What about autoX? 2011, and I only did it once or twice. So I decided to get a car that was pretty much like my BMW, but hopefully a hell of a lot more reliable.

Specs are

3.7L V6 (370Z motor) with 330HP
6 speed manual
Brembo brakes
Limited Slip
Nav
Heated leather
Bluetooth, XM, memory seats, etc. etc. etc.

May not be the fastest car, but it should drive pretty damn nice. When I test drove one back in 2008 I freaking loved it. The car MSRP'ed for $45,000. Now it is a lot more attainable I was able to get this car for about $4-$5k under NADA.

Pic from Auto Trader... I'm flying to Chicago Saturday to get it.


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2007 Sky Red Line 5-Speed - 79k - Light mods

2006 Saturn Vue 5-Speed - 103.4k
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post #38 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 01:01 AM
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Bad ride dude and enjoy it. I drove a red 08 but just didn't wanna come off the hip quite that much right now. Enter the Sky. You have a great car. Enjoy it.
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post #39 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 02:25 AM
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Congrats. A friend owns one and I've been impressed by build quality and performance. Enjoy it.

1957 Jamaican MGA
1958 MGA Twincam
1962 MGA Coupe
1971 Jensen Interceptor
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1988 Pontiac Fiero GT

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post #40 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 10:01 AM
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It is hard to argue with the Nissan Driveline and Engine
So basically, you bought a Luxury 370Z.
Can you say SLEEPER!!!
Excellent Choice Enjoy it.

FYI

I am going to quote your statement about BMWs not being reliable.
I have a bunch of M3 Snobs around me and that will be great ammunition.

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post #41 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 10:58 AM Thread Starter
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It is hard to argue with the Nissan Driveline and Engine
So basically, you bought a Luxury 370Z.
Can you say SLEEPER!!!
Excellent Choice Enjoy it.

FYI

I am going to quote your statement about BMWs not being reliable.
I have a bunch of M3 Snobs around me and that will be great ammunition.
Thanks for the kind words fellas. I know a guy with an E60 M5 (the one with the big V10) and he just spent for his Inspection II @ 60k miles... you ready for this? $6,000 He is about fed up with the car. The performance is bonkers. I got to drive it and the car is phenomenal, but you pay a price for that pretty badge.

BTW, that was paid to an independent shop and not a dealer.

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post #42 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 11:07 AM
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Thanks for the kind words fellas. I know a guy with an E60 M5 (the one with the big V10) and he just spent for his Inspection II @ 60k miles... you ready for this? $6,000 He is about fed up with the car. The performance is bonkers. I got to drive it and the car is phenomenal, but you pay a price for that pretty badge.

BTW, that was paid to an independent shop and not a dealer.
Donno why, but German machines seems to cost an arm an a leg just for an oil change it seems. When I owned my old 1988 Porsche 944 S, every visit to the dealer was over 6-700 dollars a pop.. and that was in 1980's dollars..




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post #43 of 44 (permalink) Old 03-30-2012, 11:09 PM
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Congrats Mr.Koobie !

We had two G37's in the family a few years back and standing between the two while they just warmed up was like listening to sweet music in stereo.

You should be pretty happy.

'08 RL/Black/Tan Top-5 SPD/Monsoon/Kenwood DNX6960/GMMP+Trifecta Tune/Dejon CAI/Solo Mach Shorty w/Quad Tips/Dark Tint/'SKY' Illum. WR & Door Sills/RK Sport Rear Spoiler/Painted Rear Fascia/Opel GT Antenna/Pntd Calipers/HID/DDM + JPM console
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post #44 of 44 (permalink) Old 04-01-2012, 12:35 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks man. I'm back home now and put about 400 miles on the car today. What a machine. The 3.7L sounds VERY healthy, and the interior is extremely high quality for an entry level luxury car, dare I say better than an E90.

2008 Infiniti G37S Coupe 6MT - 58k - Megan Axle Back

2007 Sky Red Line 5-Speed - 79k - Light mods

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