Havent got the seat switch fixed yet - Page 2 - Saturn Sky Forums: Saturn Sky Forum
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post #16 of 71 (permalink) Old 04-29-2019, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
I was fortunate my working mat failed after the recall went into effect but before I had gone in for the fix.
Did you have to jump up and down on it, or was just standing on it sufficient.....

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post #17 of 71 (permalink) Old 04-29-2019, 11:28 AM
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My dealer makes sure that they have the tape ready for when they make the initial appointment, apparently since they know that they are going to need it in any case, and there is not a supply limitation for it. I assume that GM ordered enough for every car, plus some overage for errors.

If the sensor is working, they pull the seat, apply the tape, reassemble everything and you are done. 45 minutes sounds about right.

If the sensor is not working they order the new one and make a second appointment when they have it in hand. That change can also take about 45 minutes.

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post #18 of 71 (permalink) Old 04-29-2019, 11:51 AM Thread Starter
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When I started the thread, it was not about how long it takes, it was about the collateral damage and the wisdom of fixing something that wasnt broken.

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post #19 of 71 (permalink) Old 04-29-2019, 12:33 PM
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If it isn't broken they won't be fixing anything. What they will be doing is installing protection to make it less likely to break in the future.

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post #20 of 71 (permalink) Old 04-29-2019, 12:43 PM
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Did you have to jump up and down on it, or was just standing on it sufficient.....
I can neither confirm nor deny that any such activity or activities took place...


Well, actually, I had swapped seats because I was getting my stock seats recovered in the orange/black covers. The temporary seats had a bad sensor so I took it in with those seats. When I was getting my seats back, I had them wait on assembling the passenger lower cushion until I was there and we swapped the new lower cushion in the loaner seat into the new seat cover that had been made using my old seats.

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When I started the thread, it was not about how long it takes, it was about the collateral damage and the wisdom of fixing something that wasnt broken.
Technically, you may have a damaged but functional sensor mat. If it is still working, the tape application will lengthen its life. However, my thinking is that if the mat has already started to tear, it will eventually fail tape or no tape. Unfortunately you cannot have them replace a working mat, only a failed one.

Looking through the documents on the recall last night I noticed that earlier remedies mentioned a "damaged or non-functioning" sensor mat while revised remedies now say a "non-functioning" sensor mat. Looks like GM figured out a mat could be damaged but functioning and the only way to inspect that would be to take the mat apart and check the 3D matrix itself for tears at which time the mat would not be able to be reassembled properly at a dealership. LOL


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post #21 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 06:42 PM
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Recently, I've noticed the passenger seat sometimes shows someone sitting there, other times it doesn't. As I'll never have children in my car, any problem with just hard wiring the connector to the passenger's seat to always arm that airbag?

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post #22 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 06:48 PM
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Recently, I've noticed the passenger seat sometimes shows someone sitting there, other times it doesn't. As I'll never have children in my car, any problem with just hard wiring the connector to the passenger's seat to always arm that airbag?
The main problem is that it won't work. It is also illegal, but that is a relatively minor detail.

The seat sensor speaks serially to the SDM, and there is a pretty complex handshaking involved. I have emulated it, but it was a pretty involved process.

The best answer is to take it to your local dealer to get it replaced as part of the recall, although you might want to wait until you get a "Service Airbag" message..

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post #23 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 07:12 PM Thread Starter
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The main problem is that it won't work. It is also illegal, but that is a relatively minor detail.

The seat sensor speaks serially to the SDM, and there is a pretty complex handshaking involved. I have emulated it, but it was a pretty involved process.

The best answer is to take it to your local dealer to get it replaced as part of the recall, although you might want to wait until you get a "Service Airbag" message..
Great, so what do we do in 10 years when it fails?

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post #24 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 08:05 PM
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Great, so what do we do in 10 years when it fails?
Look me up. I have an emulator that works, but isn't worth building as long as sensors are available.

Also, there is nothing that says your sensor has to fail. One of my cars has 104k miles on it, many, many of them with a passenger, and a working sensor.
If you have taken your car in for the recall you either have a new sensor that has been reinforced or you have had a reinforcement added to your existing sensor.
There have been cases of the sensor failing after the reinforcement is added, and unfortunately if that happens more than a year after it is done you are out of luck.

It is my belief that avoiding sharp pressure anywhere on the surface of the seat will keep the sensor from failing.

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post #25 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 08:08 PM Thread Starter
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OK then, I will ignore the offer from GM. I have been thinking, it works why mess with it.

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post #26 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 09:46 AM
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According to NHTSA, they do.
Cars.com disagrees with you https://www.cars.com/articles/recall...1420692280985/

Is there a deadline for me to get repairs made?
Safety recalls are effective for the life of your car or vehicle equipment (a child seat, for example). The exception is recalls for tires, NHTSA says; those require you to get the work done within 180 days of notification.

I am a GM Engineer.

I do not claim to be a GM representative, all of my postings are my own interpretation and personal opinions.

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post #27 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 12:19 PM Thread Starter
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Looks like I can think about this until 2023 anyway.

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post #28 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 10:43 PM
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Cars.com disagrees with you https://www.cars.com/articles/recall...1420692280985/

Is there a deadline for me to get repairs made?
Safety recalls are effective for the life of your car or vehicle equipment (a child seat, for example). The exception is recalls for tires, NHTSA says; those require you to get the work done within 180 days of notification.
While the recall itself never expires, the manufacturer is only required to make parts available for 10 years after the last vehicle is sold.
If no parts are available, the repair cannot be made, so as I stated, the recall has effectively expired. Maybe that is/was a bad choice of words, but the result is the same.

How long are you willing to wait for parts that the original supplier has scrapped the tooling for?

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post #29 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 11:08 AM
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While the recall itself never expires, the manufacturer is only required to make parts available for 10 years after the last vehicle is sold.
If no parts are available, the repair cannot be made, so as I stated, the recall has effectively expired. Maybe that is/was a bad choice of words, but the result is the same.

How long are you willing to wait for parts that the original supplier has scrapped the tooling for?
But your comment was "according to NHTSA they do" (implying.. expire you never even used the word) ... which is not true.

You did not choose a wrong word, you were replying to someone else and specifically inferred that NHTSA says they expire. WHICH IS FALSE.

Are you sure the 10 yr rule applies to recalls that happen after the 10yrs? I would assume GM and NHTSA have made an agreement about how long GM has to continue to support replacement of parts under the recall, but I have not heard what the timeline is.

And I don't know maybe Robo has seen how many of these new parts GM has made, and how long have they have agreed to keep them available, Does the 10yr clock restart? I have no clue.

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post #30 of 71 (permalink) Old 08-08-2019, 11:17 AM
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While the recall itself never expires, the manufacturer is only required to make parts available for 10 years after the last vehicle is sold.
If no parts are available, the repair cannot be made, so as I stated, the recall has effectively expired. Maybe that is/was a bad choice of words, but the result is the same.

How long are you willing to wait for parts that the original supplier has scrapped the tooling for?
and to pile on ... I don't believe there is any requirement for warehousing all parts for all cars for 10yrs.

Here is an article from automotive news, they infer manufactures may try to have inventory for 6 -10 yrs but even that is getting to be not true.

https://www.autonews.com/article/201...-car-good-luck

Here is a good breakdown of what is probably the only Law that applies and that is for a "warranty" https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/q...arts-for-a-set

"Parts"
A consequence is that vehicle manufacturers must be able to provide parts during the term of a warranty (if any) made at the time of sale. They need not make or stock these parts themselves.

Vehicle makers could choose not to do so, but then they would be required to provide a replacement vehicle or a full refund of the vehicle cost. In practice it is usually more cost effective for makers to procure replacement parts to effect a warranty repair.

A further consequence is therefore that replacement parts are also available to people who do not have a warranty claim.


So with most cars having 3yr bumper to bumper "most" parts only need to be available for 3 yrs. Powertrain and emission part warranties are longer.

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I do not claim to be a GM representative, all of my postings are my own interpretation and personal opinions.

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