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  Topic Review (Newest First)
11-17-2019 10:17 AM
Draike13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
@Draike13 I got the new MAP installed. It goes into our intake just perfectly and plugs right into the harness. Here is the info for it (I am not making this stuff up, I swear!)

GM 12623671
3.3 Bar MAP (LS1 style for use with the 2.4 LE5 Kappas from 2006-2007)

For HPT:
MAP Sensor Linear: 333.33 kPa
MAP Sensor Offset: 33.33 kPa

Those settings should be pretty easy to remember for a 3.3 bar MAP. LOL
Wow, that's hilarious and amazing! lol.
Great information as always Robo. Thanks again.
11-16-2019 06:44 PM
Robotech @Draike13 I got the new MAP installed. It goes into our intake just perfectly and plugs right into the harness. Here is the info for it (I am not making this stuff up, I swear!)

GM 12623671
3.3 Bar MAP (LS1 style for use with the 2.4 LE5 Kappas from 2006-2007)

For HPT:
MAP Sensor Linear: 333.33 kPa
MAP Sensor Offset: 33.33 kPa

Those settings should be pretty easy to remember for a 3.3 bar MAP. LOL
11-13-2019 07:13 PM
Robotech
Quote:
Originally Posted by Draike13 View Post
Awesome. Sounds good. In the meantime I may look for a 2 bar that will work. If nothing else DDMWorks sells a rather pricy one. Wont be there for a while though, so ive got time. lol
I have found one that may work.

GM 12623671 is a 3.3 bar MAP sensor off the 2003 2500 GMC Sierra with the Duramax 6.6 LS Turbo diesel V8. It is an LS1 style MAP that is just like the one in the 2006-7 LE5 Kappas. PAW says they have the data for it so now I need to get one and see if it works.
11-13-2019 01:04 PM
Draike13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
I have.a 3 bar I got off ebay but still trying to figure out what the correct parameters are. I have some leads. Once I get one that works, I'll let you know what I went with.
Awesome. Sounds good. In the meantime I may look for a 2 bar that will work. If nothing else DDMWorks sells a rather pricy one. Wont be there for a while though, so ive got time. lol
11-12-2019 04:39 PM
Robotech I have.a 3 bar I got off ebay but still trying to figure out what the correct parameters are. I have some leads. Once I get one that works, I'll let you know what I went with.
11-11-2019 12:01 AM
Draike13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
I do have the 60# injectors but for the 3 bar MAP...what year is your 2.4? 2008 and later the Werks racing kit will work...for 2006-7, it won't. The harness plug is different and while that can be easily fixed with a $14 pigtail, the hole in the manifold the sensor pushes into is too small for the later sensor. I have a new 3 bar but can't figure out what parameters the tune needs to make it work. Will be working on that later this week.
Yeah, i read that on your other post right after posting this.
I have an early model like yours. the early release 07

So which map sensor are you currently using? or which do you think i should go with for cost/ease?
11-10-2019 11:33 PM
Robotech
Quote:
Originally Posted by Draike13 View Post

Ok, so my list that I have for the parts for this build include:

Full turbo/engine/intercooler/intake/exhaust Pull from wrecked GXP - $700
Charge Pipes/CAI(RPM Motorsports) - $450
Injectors(If you still have your 60#'s for sale) - $125
Map Sensor(ZZperformance) - $70
Manual Boost Controller(Grimmspeed) - $100
Wideband O2(ZZPerformance) - $180
Tune(remote tune from different companies) - $350-500

Grand total - ~$2000

Anything im forgetting that ill need? or anyone know some better prices or have anything available?
Most of this seemed pretty good to me on pricing, but idk for sure. Its a little pricy on the pipes, but that does include the CAI pipe too which I like.
Also found that WERKS has a 3 bar map sensor kit for $130, didn't know if that was a good idea or not for starting lower boost?

Thanks again for all the help =)
I do have the 60# injectors but for the 3 bar MAP...what year is your 2.4? 2008 and later the Werks racing kit will work...for 2006-7, it won't. The harness plug is different and while that can be easily fixed with a $14 pigtail, the hole in the manifold the sensor pushes into is too small for the later sensor. I have a new 3 bar but can't figure out what parameters the tune needs to make it work. Will be working on that later this week.
11-10-2019 11:46 AM
Draike13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
Correct, IF you are using the K04 turbo and the exhaust manifold off the LNF 2.0 Turbo Redline or GXP engine, the LNF stock downpipe/cat or any aftermarket cat for that setup will work. Mine is RPM's high flow cat that PAW modified for their LNF bolt on WR-4 turbo.

IF you are going with a Wide Band O2 though, see if DDM can weld in the bung for it before shipping the cat. RPM did it for me on mine and even if you aren't going to do one NOW, having the bung there now would be beneficial. Just make sure they put in a screw in O2 plug into the new bung too.
Ok, so my list that I have for the parts for this build include:

Full turbo/engine/intercooler/intake/exhaust Pull from wrecked GXP - $700
Charge Pipes/CAI(RPM Motorsports) - $450
Injectors(If you still have your 60#'s for sale) - $125
Map Sensor(ZZperformance) - $70
Manual Boost Controller(Grimmspeed) - $100
Wideband O2(ZZPerformance) - $180
Tune(remote tune from different companies) - $350-500

Grand total - ~$2000

Anything im forgetting that ill need? or anyone know some better prices or have anything available?
Most of this seemed pretty good to me on pricing, but idk for sure. Its a little pricy on the pipes, but that does include the CAI pipe too which I like.
Also found that WERKS has a 3 bar map sensor kit for $130, didn't know if that was a good idea or not for starting lower boost?

Thanks again for all the help =)
11-08-2019 11:53 AM
Robotech
Quote:
Originally Posted by Draike13 View Post
Another question directed at Rob.

So the stock cat from the redline/gxp will fit the LE5 correct?
Any reason that the DDMWorks high flow redline cat wouldn't fit as well?

Any reason I cant think about that I couldn't go ahead and upgrade to that cat while im working on the turbo build, before I get anything else installed.

Possible? advised? bad idea?
Correct, IF you are using the K04 turbo and the exhaust manifold off the LNF 2.0 Turbo Redline or GXP engine, the LNF stock downpipe/cat or any aftermarket cat for that setup will work. Mine is RPM's high flow cat that PAW modified for their LNF bolt on WR-4 turbo.

IF you are going with a Wide Band O2 though, see if DDM can weld in the bung for it before shipping the cat. RPM did it for me on mine and even if you aren't going to do one NOW, having the bung there now would be beneficial. Just make sure they put in a screw in O2 plug into the new bung too.
11-07-2019 06:51 PM
Draike13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
Having gone both routes...I'd just get a set of pre-made pipes. By the time you get the materials and have them fabricated (unless you can do the fab work yourself) it will wind up being more expensive having the hot and cold side made than it will to just buy them.
Another question directed at Rob.

So the stock cat from the redline/gxp will fit the LE5 correct?
Any reason that the DDMWorks high flow redline cat wouldn't fit as well?

Any reason I cant think about that I couldn't go ahead and upgrade to that cat while im working on the turbo build, before I get anything else installed.

Possible? advised? bad idea?
10-29-2019 09:57 PM
Robotech Having gone both routes...I'd just get a set of pre-made pipes. By the time you get the materials and have them fabricated (unless you can do the fab work yourself) it will wind up being more expensive having the hot and cold side made than it will to just buy them.
10-29-2019 08:24 PM
Draike13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
Support brackets should all fit, it's only the plastic duct work that may be a bit different.

You need injectors. The LNF injectors are completely different (Direct injection of the LNF vs the port injection of the LE5).

The cold side pipe of the LNF is nearly useless. You need a 2.75" pipe with about a 70 degree bend in it for the LE5 cold side from the intercooler to the throttle body but 2.75" pipe is not a common size (you can get it, but not common). If you can't get 2.75" pipe, get 3" pipe and a 2.75" to 3" 90 degree elbow for the cold side pipe to throttle body connection. All connections at the intercooler are 2.5" so a 2.5" to 2.75" (or 3" depending on what you get) straight connector for the cold side pipe to intercooler will also be needed.

Of course, depending on pipe size will also dictate which size MAF bung you'll need. It may be here that finding a 2.75" MAF bung will be hard. I have found 3".

Whatever you do though, DO NOT make your cold pipe from 2.5" tubing. Trying to tune the MAF to go DOWN in pipe diameter is a nightmare. Some tuners won't even do it. My pipe is a 3" from RPM that I had made after I had a 2.5" made and tried to tune for it. Far easier tuning for a larger size than a smaller.
Would it be easier/less risk to use pre fabricated pipes made for this kind of setup? I think someone sells upgraded charge pipes right? They are just pricy.
10-28-2019 05:15 PM
Robotech
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pattsullivan View Post
Im surprised by this, thinking back im pretty sure my charge piping from the PAW kit is all 2.5" (didnt measure them though) except on the cold side a slightly larger diameter pipe is integrated for clearance where the MAF sits. The air intake is a 3" though and its bigger than the charge pipes so i know those arent 3". May have to go measure them now and see what they are.

I wonder if the smaller diameter pipe gives the air flow more turbulence (and thus the MAF doesnt give an accurate reading so then its harder to tune)? Im interested in why the smaller diameter is bad for maf but bigger is okay. Guess i shouldve paid more attention in my fluid mechanics classes haha.
Stock the 2.4 comes with a 2.75" intake. In that intake is the MAF. MAF's work by taking a reading of the airflow moving over them to determine how much air is coming in but this is just a measurement of the rate of flow (or how much the Mass of Air is that is Flowing over the sensor). Imagine the air as a stream of water. You have a stream you can walk across moving 5 mph...then you have a section of Mississippi river moving at 5 mph. Both are flowing at the same rate but which one is moving more water? The MAF has the same issue. A smaller pipe is going to be moving less air for a given MAF reading than a larger pipe is for the same MAF reading.

It is the role of the MAF tables (we have two, a low range table and a high range table...why we have two I have no idea as the high table picks up where the low table leaves off and you think of them as one big continuous table...) to interpret how much air is moving into the engine for a particular MAF reading. Go down in pipe size the numbers in the table have to be scaled down. Go up in pipe size and they have to be scaled up.

The other issue is you want that MAF's sensor to be as close to the center of the pipe as possible. 2.75" is ideal but you can go between 2.5" and 3" and still have it close enough. But for a 2.5" pipe you have now increased the chances of running off your MAF sensor's scale...and running off the scale means the ECM has to start guessing how much air above the maximum value for the MAF is really coming in to add the proper amount of fuel. Not good. Going to a larger pipe means you scale the MAF range down and you will be getting more air for a given MAF reading. Since we are forcing more air in than GM originally designed, this is a better solution because we will be less likely to run off our MAF when we are pushing in more air.

Thus the area around your MAF is critical. RPM may have done 2.5" by the intercooler then stepped it up to 2.75" or 3" before the MAF. I have attached images of my 2 cold side pipes. The first is a 2.5" pipe I had made originally. The second is one made by RPM just for me as a one off out of a 3" pipe.
10-28-2019 03:43 PM
Pattsullivan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post

The cold side pipe of the LNF is nearly useless. You need a 2.75" pipe with about a 70 degree bend in it for the LE5 cold side from the intercooler to the throttle body but 2.75" pipe is not a common size (you can get it, but not common). If you can't get 2.75" pipe, get 3" pipe and a 2.75" to 3" 90 degree elbow for the cold side pipe to throttle body connection. All connections at the intercooler are 2.5" so a 2.5" to 2.75" (or 3" depending on what you get) straight connector for the cold side pipe to intercooler will also be needed.

Of course, depending on pipe size will also dictate which size MAF bung you'll need. It may be here that finding a 2.75" MAF bung will be hard. I have found 3".

Whatever you do though, DO NOT make your cold pipe from 2.5" tubing. Trying to tune the MAF to go DOWN in pipe diameter is a nightmare. Some tuners won't even do it. My pipe is a 3" from RPM that I had made after I had a 2.5" made and tried to tune for it. Far easier tuning for a larger size than a smaller.
Im surprised by this, thinking back im pretty sure my charge piping from the PAW kit is all 2.5" (didnt measure them though) except on the cold side a slightly larger diameter pipe is integrated for clearance where the MAF sits. The air intake is a 3" though and its bigger than the charge pipes so i know those arent 3". May have to go measure them now and see what they are.

I wonder if the smaller diameter pipe gives the air flow more turbulence (and thus the MAF doesnt give an accurate reading so then its harder to tune)? Im interested in why the smaller diameter is bad for maf but bigger is okay. Guess i shouldve paid more attention in my fluid mechanics classes haha.
10-28-2019 03:14 PM
Robotech
Quote:
Originally Posted by Draike13 View Post
Yeah, I don't get that lucky. lol. But I figure and entire engine bay and exhaust pull out from a gxp for $700 is pretty good. and at least a good place to start.

Other than the brackets and plastic surrounds for the intercooler not fitting the same, is there anything else I should be cautious of going with the GXP setup?
Support brackets should all fit, it's only the plastic duct work that may be a bit different.

You need injectors. The LNF injectors are completely different (Direct injection of the LNF vs the port injection of the LE5).

The cold side pipe of the LNF is nearly useless. You need a 2.75" pipe with about a 70 degree bend in it for the LE5 cold side from the intercooler to the throttle body but 2.75" pipe is not a common size (you can get it, but not common). If you can't get 2.75" pipe, get 3" pipe and a 2.75" to 3" 90 degree elbow for the cold side pipe to throttle body connection. All connections at the intercooler are 2.5" so a 2.5" to 2.75" (or 3" depending on what you get) straight connector for the cold side pipe to intercooler will also be needed.

Of course, depending on pipe size will also dictate which size MAF bung you'll need. It may be here that finding a 2.75" MAF bung will be hard. I have found 3".

Whatever you do though, DO NOT make your cold pipe from 2.5" tubing. Trying to tune the MAF to go DOWN in pipe diameter is a nightmare. Some tuners won't even do it. My pipe is a 3" from RPM that I had made after I had a 2.5" made and tried to tune for it. Far easier tuning for a larger size than a smaller.
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