Saturn Sky Forum banner

41 - 60 of 70 Posts

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
11,238 Posts
Ah well, I apologize if my remarks have created an issue, I'll go away from this thread and not cause any more strife in this thread.

Who is going to pick up a phone and call this vendor and tell him or her to get their act in order. BTW, we are only hearing one side of this story so far.

Bye!

:seeya:
No worries. :D Easy to misunderstand intent online. :D

As for contacting the Vendor, I have already reached out to them and informed the OP of it.

Well aware of the parts distribution, my area of ignorance was that there are only 4 (HAHN, DDM, Werks, ZZP, ???) manufactures of our inter-coolers and they do not sell to other shops.

If that's true and he bought it at a shop in Florida, well Hahn is the only one of the 4 located in Florida.
I know you knew how all that worked davhamm...I just wanted to make sure anyone who ran across the post in the future had a secure understanding of it how it stands today. :D

I don't think ZZP makes an IC for us (they cater more to the FWD Ecotec crowd) but you did leave out RPM and PAW. I think Hahn, DDM, PAW, and RPM are the only ones who sell ICs for our cars. RPM may source theirs from DDM or PAW but I don't believe they do. Will ask them about that.

But RPM is in AZ and PAW is in IL.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,377 Posts
Well aware of the parts distribution, my area of ignorance was that there are only 4 (HAHN, DDM, Werks, ZZP, ???) manufactures of our inter-coolers and they do not sell to other shops.
and those of us who commented, have been around Kappa's for a full decade and had this knowledge.
>:)

I've also seen Hahn lose his $h1t on the KP forum.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
55 Posts
Discussion Starter #47
Dear William Hahne Jr.

:willy:

True story. One Christmas, long ago, our house was broken into and all our gifts were stolen. We went around the neighborhood asking friends if they had seen anything, heard anything about it, or maybe even seen some of the gifts that were missing.

Sadly, we never did get our Christmas back, the thieves got away with it and my family wound up feeling violated in a place we had previously always felt safe and secure.

I've since gone back to that neighborhood, it's now run down, filled with gangs and graffiti.

This ordeal gives me a very similar sensation.

I tried to cancel, I was assured cancellation.
You shipped the item anyway.
I returned the item as requested. You received it.
As far as i'm concerned I have been waiting for a refund for approximately 22 months.
That's 22 months of empty assurances, most of which were afforded you out of some misguided sense of respect for your brand and contribution to the automotive community.

I don't know if you just don't give a f*ck, or maybe you feel like somehow I deserve this. I assure you I did what I could and I have no sense of guilt in the matter. I really do feel taken advantage of. I've given up appealing to your sense of right. I can't think of any excuse I would accept at this point. How much grace must a customer afford you?

:willy:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
55 Posts
Discussion Starter #48
I don't think they are looking to apply pressure to the vendor directly through this post.
correct, or I would have attached e-mails and visited a dozen or so websites. my thinking is if someone twice your size takes your lunch money and you kick them in the nethers, don't expect your lunch money. I'm certainly not trying to make my life harder, I really just needed to know if I'm missing something obvious and what I might try next.

The first issue is not verifying that you had received the refund when you canceled the order. That refund would appear in a week or 2 at most. If you had not received a refund in that time, you should have been following up with the vender via email to verify that they received your cancelation request and that a refund would be forthcoming. This communication should have been via email so that there is a traceable record showing you canceled the order and that the vendor's agent verified the cancelation.
It sounds like you have been reasonable patient. Having said that, there is always two sides to every story and we are not privy to it.
If you let something go for 2 years without a resolution one way or the other, you deserve to be ignored.
The fact is, the OP has been trying for the past year and a half and each time his query has either gone unanswered or was partially answered and then dropped, but according to you, he deserves it because it’s been 2 years.
I agree and have told SkyPilot and the OP as much that there should have been more follow up on both sides here and this would not have drug on this long but to say they deserve it isn't quite fair either.
I did try, but being honest priorities in life shift for all of us and I can't spend all my time humping a vendor for a refund and it does slip in favor of other things that come and go (like getting married, which ate a few months of my life and continues to eat my life weeks at a time).. and with my job I sometimes work 12-18 hour days, sleep, shower, then repeat -- hell, in the last year alone I've worked a few 30 hour blocks to meet deadlines.

Nobody should "need" to hump a vendor for a refund, period. Ever.

to be transparent:

on may-1-2016 the order was confirmed
on may-3 the debit to my account was posted
on may-5 I hadn't received an update on the order, understand my car was out of commission until replaced. so I e-mailed asking for an update on shipping/etc.
on may-13 I asked for an update since I still had no delivery estimate. days? weeks? months? understand my car was out of commission.
on may-15 I was informed the ICs were back-ordered by several months.
on may-17 I explained this wouldn't work since I was without transportation until I could drop in a new IC. I then immediately placed an overnight order with a competitor (for 40% higher total cost in the end, but it also bought me a shipping confirmation within 24-48 hours)
on may-19 I received an apology, that I should see a refund the following week.

i felt pretty good.

no refund, but I kept checking every weekend.. the replacement IC and the IC that should have been refunded, combined, set me back pretty hard and monthly bills were coming.

on jun-3 I inquired about my refund, I waited an extra couple of weeks just in case. maybe times were hard? maybe their processor sucked?
on jun-13 I was asked if anyone had contacted me yet about my refund, I said no. confirmed no refund had been credited to my account, double checked with a bank teller to ensure there were no pending transactions on the account (this account is not in use anymore -- except to receive this refund.)

i kept checking my account for that refund.

no refund.

on aug-8 I was e-mailed that my item was shipped.
on aug-12 I e-mailed and said to retract the shipment, cancel the order, and refund the money.
on aug-13 I forwarded prior e-mails.
on aug-15 I received an apology. I was told they would need to receive the item back to process the refund. I was asked to refuse the delivery.
on aug-19 I confirmed that the item was returned to sender.
on aug-22 UPS confirmed delivery of the item back to the return address.

on oct-10 I inquired about the refund.

on oct-27-2017 1 year being sufficient time to process a refund, I inquired again. yes, i probably could have followed up more over the course of a year, but I also have long and impressive list of other life events that were more important than humping a vendor for a refund. :( from marriage to struggles at work to what ultimately became a job change.. twice.. life happens.

on dec-1-2017 I follow up and I send a link to my order, along with the tracking number, just in case they had lost this information.

no refund.

on dec-24, xmas-eve I gave up on asking for a refund, so I posted here for advice.

I know the owner is active on various forums, or has been in the past, so i figured there's a sliver of a chance he would stumble upon this post. it's actually surprising to hear so many of you have met one another and our vendors IRL.. I wasn't aware. probably I should have attended some meet and greets.

Send them a certified letter via USPS, return receipt requested, lay out everything as you did in the first message, and demand a cashier's check via return mail for the full amount of the expected refund as well as a a few more bucks (pick a number) for the aggravation of not getting a prompt refund in the first place. Give them a deadline for your receipt of the check, two weeks is good. Tell them in your letter that you intend to take them to small claims court if they don't comply with your demands.
That's a pretty solid idea.. actually. probably what a lawyer would charge me to go do anyway. Probably required by law to have an official demand via certified mail.

I didn't want my bank to issue a chargeback if it was avoidable, I didn't want to have to fly out to FL to file and appear in front of a judge. I didn't feel like brushing up on FL law, either, I AM NOT A LAWYER. I have MUCH better things to do with my time, like fixing my car so I can find new ways to break it..

as a last ditch effort I offered to take a check just in case there was some other problem (like the payment processor) then forwarded the order and UPS information to them in case they had lost it.

probably in the future I would add humping the phone at a 1:1 ratio to the sending of e-mails.. but of the 3 vendors I've had to get refunds issued from I'm only missing the funds from one of them, and the same process was used with them all.

a certain amount of humping always seems required, though.. I realize this.

Thanks @Robotech for reaching out, unfortunately it had the same effect as all prior communication with the vendor. This doesn't change my opinion of you, but it certainly reinforces my now entirely-soured opinion of the Hahn Racecraft brand.

Is this final post an attempt to pressure Bill? No. Nothing said here is going to change what has happened. Is it an attempt to warn other Kappa owners or anyone doing a google.com search for Hahn Racecraft Intercoolers? Unfortunately, yes.

If you want my opinion, as an aggressive tuner :cool: ORDER FROM DDM.

Not only is Dave a stellar f*cking dude when it comes to communicating with customers, the helpful culture coming out of DDM really does show EVERYWHERE the brand appears.. and to add: their intercooler, charge tubes, and couplers have all taken a _severe_ beating.. I have zero regrets except that I didn't order from DDM from the start.. Oh, they're also on my list of vendors that actually processes refunds in a reasonable timeframe.. :cheers:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,294 Posts
We actually have both sides of the story. The non response from the other side seems to cement it for me.

Point blank, this board is supposed to be about Kappa enthusiasts helping each other. That is exactly what is being done here. We have a few vendors that really are not all about service.

I have only ordered from DDM, Solo and Windrestrictor. All highly recommended by nearly every single poster. This board should be about confirmation of great service, but it also should be a place that honesty is the only factor, and those that do not do business correctly should suffer the consequences.

Okay off the soap box.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,884 Posts
I am curious about one thing, who promised you a refund? Bill himself, or an employee? The only reason I ask is because the website is quite clear that there are NO REFUNDS.

PRODUCT RETURNS and CREDIT:

Product may only be returned within 20 days of invoice date. Restocking fees of up to 20% will be assessed. NO REFUNDS. All sales are final, and returns will result in credit that can be used against a future purchase ONLY.
https://www.hahnracecraft.com/pages/contact-us

:dunno:

.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,267 Posts
Dave, that is an extremely valid point on the website. We sometimes forget to read some of the details. But it also makes you wonder when that admonishment was placed on the website.?? And that, my friend, would be VERY HARD to determine. But, if a company is up front about policies, that admonishment would be on the original invoice. The OP might answer that one. :willy:

Dave, thanks for your post.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,884 Posts
Dave, that is an extremely valid point on the website. We sometimes forget to read some of the details. But it also makes you wonder when that admonishment was placed on the website.?? And that, my friend, would be VERY HARD to determine. But, if a company is up front about policies, that admonishment would be on the original invoice. The OP might answer that one. :willy:

Dave, thanks for your post.
The unfortunate thing here, is that the amount in question is relatively small. The OP could file a small claims action, but would have to travel to Florida to have a hearing. If he did so, it is likely that he would get a judgement, but then he'd have to spend even more money to collect on the judgement, and at every step along this journey, there are people trying to collect fees and in the end it just isn't worth what you are going to end up with in terms of a recovery.

And vendors know this. At the same time the vendor is out the cost of shipping the product both ways, there are expenses involved with the paperwork, restocking, et al.

Regardless of what happens, both sides lose. It's unfortunate.

:dunno:

.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,884 Posts
Dave, that is an extremely valid point on the website. We sometimes forget to read some of the details. But it also makes you wonder when that admonishment was placed on the website.?? And that, my friend, would be VERY HARD to determine. But, if a company is up front about policies, that admonishment would be on the original invoice. The OP might answer that one. :willy:

Dave, thanks for your post.
Using the Internet Wayback Machine, the earliest I can find that information on Hahn's web site was mid-April, 2016. It wasn't there in March, 2016 archives.

https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://hahnracecraft.com/

:dunno:

.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
398 Posts
Wilson, I hope he does the right thing eventually. I know how frustrating it can be when this happens. I have had this same issue with 2 other well known vendors here, the first issue only took 4.5 months to get resolved. They finally resolved the day that I had posted about my ordeal but didn't name them directly. I had issues with my product from the start. From having metal shavings in it to having their name loosely riveted to tubes that are supposed to hold 24psi of air. I did lose my shipping...twice....from him (about $60 IMSMC), but I will NEVER do business with him again and I try to warn anyone thinking about doing business with him when I can. You can deduce whom I'm talking about when I tell you that I will ONLY purchase with DDM, Solo, ZZP, and Windrestrictor. The other vendor I had an issue with I chalked up to a lesson as it was less then $20 and not worth my time or effort to get resolved.

For the record I was thinking about ordering an intercooler from the vendor you're having issues with. A coworker is a drag tuner and highler recommends them for their products, but after hearing this, I might go another route...even though my car is already set up for his intercooler. :(
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
11,238 Posts
Thanks @Robotech for reaching out, unfortunately it had the same effect as all prior communication with the vendor. This doesn't change my opinion of you, but it certainly reinforces my now entirely-soured opinion of the Hahn Racecraft brand.
My understanding is that you have received a refund from them. Can you update us?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,198 Posts
Hopefully the OP can exert the same amount of effort to update us on his refund status as he did to initiate the complaint.


_______________________________________________________________________
 
41 - 60 of 70 Posts
Top