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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Took the passenger up and installed AB 360 today.
Now have the following.


Both lights on and air bag warnings ⚠
What do I need to do now to resolve this issue with the system ?
 

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Took the passenger up and installed AB 360 today.
Now have the following.


Both lights on and air bag warnings ⚠
What do I need to do now to resolve this issue with the system ?
The has been little to no success reported from anyone using the Airbag 360 module.

Has your car already been through the recall? If so, was it more than a year ago?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yes 2018. Took it to the dealer and they confirmed the seat sensor is faulty. They contacted GM and the response is its out of warranty. They wanted 1,300 to replace the passenger seat pressure sensor. So I purchased AB 360 and installed it. Wrote AB 360 about the issue after installation but not heard back. Sensor emulator should be an easy fix. What am I missing ?
 

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Yes 2018. Took it to the dealer and they confirmed the seat sensor is faulty. They contacted GM and the response is its out of warranty. They wanted 1,300 to replace the passenger seat pressure sensor. So I purchased AB 360 and installed it. Wrote AB 360 about the issue after installation but not heard back. Sensor emulator should be an easy fix. What am I missing ?
I'm going to guess that in 2018 it was still working, they did the reinforcement, and sent you on your way. This was definitely not GM's finest hour.

What you are missing is that it isn't that easy, and Airbag360 apparently hasn't figured it out. They have been really successful with a lot of other platforms, but for some reason can't get ours right.
 

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It's been a while since I was active here. A few years ago I had the same problem and in Europe there was no recall for the Opel GT. That's why I had to look for another solution and it turned out that the airbag360 emulator didn't work. In the end I had a modification carried out on the SDM by Airbag24 in Berlin. With this modification, the passenger airbag is always activated, even if no passenger is present. Many Opel GT drivers in Europe have had their SDM modified there.

A lot has been written about this in this link: Airbag360 installed - Service Airbag DTC still present.

This was several years ago now and I haven't had any problems since.

Greetings from the Netherlands
 

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Does the emulator trick the system into thinking there is a passenger in the seat, or there is no passenger? In older vehicles, the passenger air bag was active all the time.

If you want to activate the passenger air bag 100% of the time, I wonder if you could modify a failed sensor. Maybe it is as simple as cutting the connection near the controller and short two or more connections together.

Here is the passenger-presence conglomerate.
Product Cap Hood Motor vehicle Sleeve


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Motor vehicle Tire Paint Rectangle Font
 

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Does the emulator trick the system into thinking there is a passenger in the seat, or there is no passenger? In older vehicles, the passenger air bag was active all the time.

If you want to activate the passenger air bag 100% of the time, I wonder if you could modify a failed sensor. Maybe it is as simple as cutting the connection near the controller and short two or more connections together.

Here is the passenger-presence conglomerate.
The AirBag360 emulator - if it worked - would tell the system that the seat was occupied, so the airbag is always armed, and the seat belt has to be fastened to avoid the warning light and chime.

The AirBag24 reprogramming does the same thing, but requires that the SDM be sent to Germany.

Unfortunately it is not as easy as shorting conections together, or someone would have done it long ago.

Hello @OmegaUser it is good to see you again. How does the AirBag24 programming affect the seat belt warning?
 

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Hi John,

After the reprogramming of the SDM by Airbag24 there is no longer an (acoustic) seat belt warning for the passenger.

Greetings
Walter
Thank you Walter. In appreciation, when I am out tonight I will have an extra beer, just for you. I will be sure that it is something good.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Does Anyone know of other work around for this issue ?
I'm going to guess that in 2018 it was still working, they did the reinforcement, and sent you on your way. This was definitely not GM's finest hour.

What you are missing is that it isn't that easy, and Airbag360 apparently hasn't figured it out. They have been really successful with a lot of other platforms, but for some reason can't get ours right.
Thanks John, Believe it was the reinforcement tape. Note: that after installing the 360 the passenger seat air bag shows both panel lights On and Off illuminated. The drivers panel still show the Airbag red light on and the written alarm indication is on too. I can not understand why this would be so complex, Like what is the output type from the seat pressure sensor unit, One would suppose its either on or off but must be more complex. The engineering must be mandated by the our federal government to make it not easy or impossible to bypass the seat pressure sensor. Has anyone successfully installed an Airbag 360 ???
 

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The PPS communicates with the SDM via serial data, and there is a complex handshaking involved to confirm that the PPS is functioning properly, and then to communicate the status. The ON and OFF lights are actually controlled by the PPS based on instructions from the SDM, so it gets even more complicated.

Keep in mind that this system was developed when the requirement was very new, and we were very nearly the lab rats for the hardware.

I am not aware of a single successful Airbag360 installation.

As a side note, I am close to having a functional emulator, and currently have two of them being tested in cars. It still needs more testing, then the distibution has to be worked out, so don't hold your breath for it.
 
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As a side note, I am close to having a functional emulator, and currently have two of them being tested in cars. It still needs more testing, then the distibution has to be worked out, so don't hold your breath for it.
For the benefit of our newer members, would you care to explain how long you have been working on this little project?

I sometimes think people don't understand (or comprehend) how complex an issue this is, and how difficult it is to work around the issues.

Thanks.

.
 

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For the benefit of our newer members, would you care to explain how long you have been working on this little project?

I sometimes think people don't understand (or comprehend) how complex an issue this is, and how difficult it is to work around the issues.

Thanks.

.
We started looking at this in earnest about 5 years ago, at the same time that RoboTech was pushing NHTSA for a recall. If anyone is truly interested they can go back and read through some of the early discussions about the technology, and be amused at how little we actually knew then.

I bought some data analysis equipment and spent several months of evenings monitoring, decoding, and analyzing the apparently unique serial communication used by the system. Eventually the pattern of messages became discernable and I was able to write enough code to allow a microprocessor to convince the SDM that it was a functional PPS and to then be able to carry on the conversations needed to make the system function.

I have built two of the emulators, both of which have a switch to control "seat occupied, airbag armed" and "seat empty, airbag disarmed" modes. Gen 1 is about 90% reliable, meaning that 1 time out of 10 communication will fail at power-up and require cycling power to establish communications. Gen 2 is better, but hasn't had enough testing to quantify reliability. Neither unit has had a problem after the initial power-up sequence has completed.

There was a pretty big gap in progress because I wasn't happy enough with the reliability that I could achieve, couldn't find a way to improve it, and GM announced the recall. I started working on it again this year mainly because of post-recall falures. I am still concerned about supplying these to anyone, since failure during use would present a real potential for problems, so that is a hurdle that is yet to be overcome.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
John That's interesting..what d o you mean cycling power? Is that disconnect the car battery or just restart the car ?
 

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John That's interesting..what d o you mean cycling power? Is that disconnect the car battery or just restart the car ?
Restarting the car.
 

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WE need a fix! My GM sesnsor replacement under warrany - has already broken - with very little useage!!! Driving with the Service Air Bar light on as don't think really broken but don't want to take into GM to get code cleared - so will pull passenger seat shrtly and then determine next step in this crazy sensor issue.
 

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I have a question for the sake of my own education alone.

Is the need to repair, replace, or trick the passenger air bag system solely for the purpose of passing state inspections? Or does a failed passenger air bag system affect the drivability of the car in some fashion?

My Sky passenger air bag has always worked so I have no first hand experience in dealing with the problem.
 

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WE need a fix! My GM sesnsor replacement under warrany - has already broken - with very little useage!!! Driving with the Service Air Bar light on as don't think really broken but don't want to take into GM to get code cleared - so will pull passenger seat shrtly and then determine next step in this crazy sensor issue.
Mine apparently broke while being dormant for 3 years. Makes me wonder if it is not really broken but flagged the error during new battery replacement.
 

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I have a question for the sake of my own education alone.

Is the need to repair, replace, or trick the passenger air bag system solely for the purpose of passing state inspections? Or does a failed passenger air bag system affect the drivability of the car in some fashion?

My Sky passenger air bag has always worked so I have no first hand experience in dealing with the problem.
The PPS must be functional for the passenger airbag to operate.
 

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Mine apparently broke while being dormant for 3 years. Makes me wonder if it is not really broken but flagged the error during new battery replacement.
Whle it is the most common failure by far, the PPS is not the only part of the airbag system that can fail. Have you read the code?
 
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