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I think that with talk of the 240 hp version of this engine this will be a notible sports car. The ass beating he was taking about from the japanese are all 4 and 6 cylinder power cars. The fastest machines they have are well tuned v6's. Considering the weight of the Solstice (and sky by association) they stronger engine will give it a respectable (if not envy deserving) time of mid to low 5's.

Just like any other car out there (in this market to be sure) people will by it for looks.. others will buy it for fun (and others will buy it rice it and race it).

So although entertaining, I think this is a good direction for GM and hardly is a death nail.
 

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What in particular do you agree with about this?

I read this and I'm appalled at what I read. This person sounds like an uneducated homophobe. He's pissed because the car doesn't have more power, so he declares it a car for gays and women? It's a freakin Roadster not, a 100% Performance Sports Car. Specificaly the base model of a Roadster. That's what the GXP/RL models will do, provide a performance oriented version. A car doesn't have to have "teh most HP EVAR!11!" to be a good car. Roadsters are about handling first and foremost, not having a giant HP value on a car that can't do anything but go in a straight line. If he wants to complain about performance values on the cheapest Roadster in production, he needs to stop expecting a Corvette when you're paying for back to basics Roadster.
 

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why would someone even write that

Gm has done a really cool thing with the sky and the solstice how can you beat a $20000 roadster with near 50/50 weight dist. And then say they only made room for a four cylinder motor. the car will handle great if not excellent and it has the ecotec a race proven motor you can get at least 500whp with all stock equpment and a turno upgrade how can you beat that this man has no idea what he is talking about and is still living in the (it wont be fast unless it has an 8 cyilinder motor era)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
brentil said:
What in particular do you agree with about this?

I read this and I'm appalled at what I read. This person sounds like an uneducated homophobe.
When I say I agree with it, I'm referring to the comments about GMs decision making in the past & present. Whether anyone is gay or not is their business and I could care less--I am strictly focusing on comments regarding GMs decision making and execution.
 

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radtech said:

What's missing in the article was an understanding of car design and building.
Having worked for The General many years ago (as a computer programmer for Production, Engineering & Materials Requirments systems), I know that everything has to be in balance. Nothing changes in a vacum. You don't significantly change HP without looking at tire speed rating, shocks, brakes, Yada-yada and before you know it, voila, a 50HP increase has added a pile of weight, different equipment and parts and $2K to the cost.
That will happen with the GT version, but that's why you'll pay $3 - 4K more for that version. Had GM come out with that up front as their base model, everyone would be pissin and moanin about the price. :rolleyes:

So the base model is a Wolf in cheap clothing :lol:
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
SkyHawk said:
Had GM come out with that up front as their base model, everyone would be pissin and moanin about the price. :rolleyes:

So the base model is a Wolf in cheap clothing :lol:
They could have offered 3 engines: 170HP 2.4L, 253HP 2.0L Turbo, or 400HP LS2 6.0L. No one would be pissin and moanin because they would have a choice. Also, according to Mallet the stock tranny and rear can withstand +600HP. But leave it to GM to dictate what we get as usual.
 

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radtech said:
They could have offered 3 engines: 170HP 2.4L, 253HP 2.0L Turbo, or 400HP LS2 6.0L. No one would be pissin and moanin because they would have a choice. Also, according to Mallet the stock tranny and rear can withstand +600HP. But leave it to GM to dictate what we get as usual.
To come out with those 3 versions at the same time would significantly delayed launch of the vehicle (by at least a year or 2). It takes considerable time, effort and moolah to develop different versions of the same base vehicle.
And time and moolah are no friends of Der General... :D
 

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Discussion Starter #9
SkyHawk said:
To come out with those 3 versions at the same time would significantly delayed launch of the vehicle (by at least a year or 2). It takes considerable time, effort and moolah to develop different versions of the same base vehicle.
And time and moolah are no friends of Der General... :D
lol...you're right except it would take Der General at least 5 years. Case in point...how long did it take for the Concept to go to production?
 

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radtech said:
lol...you're right except it would take Der General at least 5 years. Case in point...how long did it take for the Concept to go to production?
Actually GM gets praise for the Solstice development cycle. The Solstice has one of the shortest development cycles of pretty much any car in the last 20 years. It went from pure concept to saleable in less then 3 years. Most cars take anywahere from 4-8 years of development time. It doesn't matter if it's GM or Toyota. Cars in general take a long time to design and make.

If they had put all three engine choices in it would have easily taken 5 years instead of 3. The quick design time was due to focusing on one engine to start with. Then one year more of development after that arrives the GXP/RL versions. You also get the benefits of the previous years worth of cars issues being fixed by then to provide an even better car.
 

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brentil said:
Actually GM gets praise for the Solstice development cycle. The Solstice has one of the shortest development cycles of pretty much any car in the last 20 years. It went from pure concept to saleable in less then 3 years. Most cars take anywahere from 4-8 years of development time. It doesn't matter if it's GM or Toyota. Cars in general take a long time to design and make.

If they had put all three engine choices in it would have easily taken 5 years instead of 3. The quick design time was due to focusing on one engine to start with. Then one year more of development after that arrives the GXP/RL versions. You also get the benefits of the previous years worth of cars issues being fixed by then to provide an even better car.
It may be a bit of a stretch to say that it the Solstice went from concept to saleable in LT 3 yrs. It was introduced as a concept at the NAIAS on Jan 6th, 2002 (exactly 3.5 years ago tomorrow) - see URL below - and we can assume that the concept was developed before introduction and we're still not close to when you can say the Solstice is truly "saleable".
So it's more like 4 years.. Don't get me wrong, fer der General, that's not too shabby.. :)
http://www.canadiandriver.com/news/02naias_gallery1.htm
 

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radtech said:
They could have offered 3 engines: 170HP 2.4L, 253HP 2.0L Turbo, or 400HP LS2 6.0L. No one would be pissin and moanin because they would have a choice. Also, according to Mallet the stock tranny and rear can withstand +600HP. But leave it to GM to dictate what we get as usual.
Since performance and sports cars began we have heard this same argument for more power right from the start... Way back in 1953 when the Corvette came out with a 6 cylinder engine they said it was underpowered... the muscle cars of the 60's started out as family sedans... before they dropped in the big engines...
Ok I will probably ruffel some feathers, but these small sports roadsters were not being designed for breakneck 0-60 times, or 1/4 mile times or top speed, they were designed to be the best handling most fun to drive cars for less money than you would have to spend elsewhere. thats why you se near 50/50 weight distribution, double wishbone front and rear suspension with bilstine shocks, a.9g skidpad rating, which with true performance tires will probably be 1g+... It's ok to want more power, but be patient, it will come with time.. besides these are right in the ballpark with the other small roadsters in this class...
 

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classic66vair said:
Since performance and sports cars began we have heard this same argument for more power right from the start... Way back in 1953 when the Corvette came out with a 6 cylinder engine they said it was underpowered... the muscle cars of the 60's started out as family sedans... before they dropped in the big engines...
Ok I will probably ruffel some feathers, but these small sports roadsters were not being designed for breakneck 0-60 times, or 1/4 mile times or top speed, they were designed to be the best handling most fun to drive cars for less money than you would have to spend elsewhere. thats why you se near 50/50 weight distribution, double wishbone front and rear suspension with bilstine shocks, a.9g skidpad rating, which with true performance tires will probably be 1g+... It's ok to want more power, but be patient, it will come with time.. besides these are right in the ballpark with the other small roadsters in this class...
When the soldiers returning from England after WWII brought over 50hp MG's they started beating full-sized V8's on road courses because they had handling. This car handles as evidenced by one of the highest lateral g numbers outside of dedicated racecar engineering. Don't race for pink slips in the 1/4 mile but instead on a road course.
 

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"But it's still a great car to drive to brunch on Fire Island, and the trunk holds two pairs of chaps."

Where do I sign? Seriously, though- you have to take a ferry to brunch on Fire Island and any homo worth knowing needs a fast car. As long as it takes me to get ready to go somewhere, I can't dawdle getting to my destination: fashionably late usually means less than three hours.

We'll see how Steve and Laura like the view of my fabulous rear bumper!
 

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Doesn't Matter

I'm Not Gay Nor Am I A Girl....i'm A Grown Married Man And I Like The Car, And I Am Buying The Car....i Don't Plan On Racing It In The Daytona 500, So "ridin' Along In My Automobile" Suits Me Just Fine.
 
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